# Running power through finished ceiling



## dborns (Oct 24, 2018)

We’re starting our lighting project for the kitchen, living room, and laundry.  The kitchen and laundry have one big light in the middle of the ceiling, and the living room only has two can lights over the mantel.  We want to remove the current lights and install can lights.  Unfortunately, that means drilling through joists blindly to run wire.  My thought was to drill small holes in the drywall so that I can get an inspection scope on each side of the joist so I can see if there’s electrical or plumbing on the other side.  This will require patching of those holes before the ceiling is sprayed.  The kitchen won’t be bad as I’ll only have to go through 5 joists; the living room will be twice that.  I do have a flex bit that I’ll be using.  
Is there any other options or tips on how to do this?  

As far as power to the lights, I’m hoping to find the wires that are running to the current lights to use those.


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## JoeD (Oct 24, 2018)

Cut a 4 inch wide strip down the length of where you need the wire to run. Drywall is easy to patch.


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## Snoonyb (Oct 24, 2018)

Is it the assumption that the dwelling is either a 2 story, or a flat roof, and you have yet to establish the direction and placement of the ceiling/floor joists?

If in fact you need to drill through the joists, drill only in the middle 3rd.


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## dborns (Oct 24, 2018)

I appreciate the suggestions.  I’ve tried to post pics to explain better, but they won’t work for some reason.  

It’s the first floor ceilings.  I do know the joist location as the ceilings are scrapped so I can see where it’s nailed up.  I’m not just worried about electrical, but there is a bathroom above the kitchen, so plumbing maybe an issue...

As far as cutting a 4” strip out the whole length.  I don’t know drywall so what would be easier to fix, a 4” strip or a couple small holes between joists?  The inspection scope has a 1/4” tip, so my plan was to drill a 1/4” hole in between the joists to make sure I wouldn’t drill into anything.


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## Snoonyb (Oct 24, 2018)

Thanks, a simple stud finder will help you locate any hidden framing members, the more technical will help you locate, and identify plumbing and elec. products, and in turn help us in assisting you.

A building plan and/or layout can help as well.


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## dborns (Oct 24, 2018)




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## dborns (Oct 24, 2018)

I finally got pics to work.  The first one is of the kitchen.  I have to go across five joists from light to light.  
The second is the current light that will go away.  I'm assuming the power wire for it is just coming through a hole in the ceiling.  It will be replaced with two small pendant lights.  I was hoping to use that wire for the can lights also, but I may just put in a triple switch box and just ran a new switch and wires to the cans. 
The third is the living room.  It'll be tough because it's so long.  I'll be going through a dozen on each side of the room to run the lights.


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## bud16415 (Oct 24, 2018)

You still need room to get up in there to pull wires and drill holes and there is going to be patching to the drywall if you make a 4” hole for your hand or a straight slot.


If you are going to tackle the project yourself you need to learn some drywall skills or find someone to finish your patches. Sounds like you had popcorn and scraped it off.


If you are going to use the power and switch to the light that is there you will need to put a light at that location also as you can’t hide wire connections in the ceiling. We used our central location for a ceiling fan.


I put multi can lighting in our kitchen ceiling and wired them in rows based on tasks in the kitchen. We often only turn on part of them at a time.


For me it isn’t really much harder if any patching an 8-10 inch slot and it gives me room to work.   


If you need help with tips and tricks on drywall just ask.


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## dborns (Oct 24, 2018)

Sorry about the bad drawing, I wanted to get it up here to help.  The kitchen and LR both have can lights currently, and they are the red ones on the drawing.  The kitchen has one over the sink, and the LR has the two at the mantel.  Also, I forgot to draw the joists in the LR.  They sit horizontally if you're looking at the pic.


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## dborns (Oct 24, 2018)

Thank you Sir, for the info.  Please don't take this as arguing, I just want to give you my idea's on how I plan to do this, and figure out if there are easier ways. 

Yes, we had popcorn ceilings that I scraped off.  I have a drywall guy that's going to respray with knockdown, so I will not be doing the drywall work.  I want to make the least amount of damage, so he's not having to do a bunch of patching. 

As far as making a hole so that I have more room to work and pull wire.  I'm using a 4' flexbit, so it will reach from light to light.  None of the lights are more than 4' apart, so if I cut the hole for one light, I'll be able to reach the other with the bit.  I can then attach the wire to the end of the bit, and pull it from the other light hole. 

Yes, we will be putting pendant lights over the island in place of the current monstrosity.  My initial plan was to use that switch to power both the pendant lights and the new cans, but that switch is a three way, so messing with that isn't something I want to get into.  I can put in a new switch in a new triple box, and run the cans off of it.  That way the cans are on one switch and the pendants on another.


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## Snoonyb (Oct 24, 2018)

"As far as making a hole so that I have more room to work and pull wire. I'm using a 4' flexbit, so it will reach from light to light. None of the lights are more than 4' apart, so if I cut the hole for one light, I'll be able to reach the other with the bit. I can then attach the wire to the end of the bit, and pull it from the other light hole."

If there are no unknown obstructions, so I wouldn't count on that, I would first know and then drill.. So, besides the possibility of plumbing, how about elec. romex stapled to the joists. 

"Yes, we will be putting pendant lights over the island in place of the current monstrosity. My initial plan was to use that switch to power both the pendant lights and the new cans, but that switch is a three way, so messing with that isn't something I want to get into."

The 3way is really not that big a deal if the new fixture is in the same location. Shorter or longer just requires additional 14/3.

"I can put in a new switch in a new triple box, and run the cans off of it. That way the cans are on one switch and the pendants on another."

If the hot pair is in the ceiling, do you have the correct boring to add 2-14/2 romex, or in the case of another 3way 1-14/2 and 1-14/3 in the wall double top plate to add the switch?

As for the living room, you need to put some thought into what you need to demo, such as, are the fixtures opposing each other side to side and the probability of span blocking in the joist runs that you need to remove drywall to drill through.


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## bud16415 (Oct 24, 2018)

Your idea is fine and could work. I have fished wires many different ways thru finished walls and ceilings. Here you have the opportunity to do it the easy way because you have a guy coming to finish the ceiling anyway.


His cost is largely going to be getting his men and equipment to your place for a small job. I would ask him if he has to patch a few slots you open for wiring how that will impact his price. All you have to do is drill thru one wire or pipe and the cost to fix that will be way more than his cost to patch an access slot.


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## dborns (Oct 25, 2018)

I drilled the access holes, and I'm glad I bought the scope.  The first hole where a can is going to be placed has a drain line coming down and running down the middle of the joist.  I think I'll still be able to use a 5" can, I'll just have to move it over towards the other joist.
The second hole has a copper water line running down in between the joists.  The third hole has an electrical wire stapled to the middle of the joist....


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