# "Luxury" Vinyl



## Spicoli43 (Feb 23, 2020)

Hi, I see threads on vinyl flooring, but most go back a decade or more. Does anybody have current luxury vinyl flooring that works well with pets / is waterproof?

I'm looking for opinions from people that have had the product down for a year or more with good results. I would value opinions here much more than reviews from "real people" on the store sites. 

I'm replacing carpet / fake wood laminate in the house since it was built in 2006. I assume the floor is all flat because of the age of the house. 

I'm basically down to the following 3 brands, but if people have real good opinions of others, I'm all ears...

Thanks.

https://www.lowes.com/pd/Mohawk-7-P...kfield-Luxury-Vinyl-Plank-Flooring/1000560719

https://www.lowes.com/pd/ProCore-Pl...uxury-Locking-Vinyl-Plank-Flooring/1000848714

https://www.wayfair.com/home-improv...-4803-x-5mm-luxury-vinyl-plank-mvp10015.html?


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## bud16415 (Feb 23, 2020)

I have done several laminate jobs going back to when it was first invented and only was T&G and the pieces needed to be glued together at the T&G and then float as a whole floor. I have never installed vinyl but my nephew did his kitchen dining room in vinyl lay down planks a few years ago. It looked beautiful at first and then the first summer with a couple windows and a sliding door the sunlight spot heated the floor and the joints opened and closed with thermal expansion.


Here is an article about it.


https://www.flooring-professionals....l-expansion-luxury-vinyl-tile-plank-flooring/


I have no idea if these problems have been fixed or not. Other than that it is a nice product to work with and looks nice. I would use it in a finished basement for sure.


Welcome to the forum.


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## Spicoli43 (Feb 23, 2020)

Thanks, Bud. 

The front of my house faces North, so I don't have to worry about that at all. The South was brutal, as in I couldn't even go on the deck that was there for a few minutes in the summer. I scrapped that and had a patio cover put on that eliminates the sun beat down 95 percent or so. I know what you're talking about though, as the floor in the dining room by the back door shows 8 years worth of the sun, while the floor behind the back wall doesn't show any wear. 

One brand I was looking at had ridiculous warranty info, as in it sounded nearly impossible for anyone to do a good install and be covered. (Breathe on it wrong, and it's not covered)... That's basically what I'm looking to avoid. The problem is, if you go into Lowe's, nobody there has a clue about anything, and of course Online stores don't either.


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## bud16415 (Feb 23, 2020)

We have some pro flooring guys here so hang in there and they will drop in I'm sure. We are a small forum so everyone isn't here all the time, but the folks we have know their stuff. The search feature works also. Sometimes you can find out a lot from old threads.


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## Spicoli43 (Feb 23, 2020)

That works for me. I have to get all my ducks in a row as far as knowing the warranties, having all the install equipment, convincing my body that it's a good idea etc..


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## bud16415 (Feb 23, 2020)

I hear ya and especially the body part. I’m 64 now and working on my knees is getting a little dicey.


I say I work smarter now not harder and I also don’t try and set any speed records. If it takes a week it takes a week.


Putting down this snap together flooring is not that hard skill wise the worst part of the job is getting everything out of the area and getting a good smooth surface to lay it on.


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## Spicoli43 (Feb 23, 2020)

I'm late 40's, Feel 80 in the morning. I know the felling of Used to Could. Every time I lay down to change the oil, I remind myself it's $6000 for a Car Lift. I'm too old to sell myself on the corner though!


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## oldognewtrick (Feb 23, 2020)

I ripped the carpet and vinyl sheet out of my camper last year and put downwn LVP, couldn't be any happier with it.


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## Spicoli43 (Feb 23, 2020)

That camper looks great, but I would screw it up with gravel on the bottom of a cooler, fish guts with the smell that never goes away etc. 

Can I get the Manufacturer name?


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## rbm328 (Feb 24, 2020)

we put down luxury evp from Lumber Liquidators and couldn't be more happy with it. strongly advise you check them out too. its waterproof (we have dogs and grandchildren).  without going to look, our planks were extremely heavy (installer said heaviest hes ever put down) and we also installed upgraded underlay.  we've had it for over a year and absolutely love it.  don't go to lowes - i used to work there.


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## Spicoli43 (Feb 24, 2020)

Thanks rbm, LL isn't here, but I remember when they had problems with off gassing. Do you think that is resolved?

Don't go to Lowe's because they carry inferior brands, or don't get them to install? 

I have been burned by their garbage appliances (Samsung, Maytag), but I go there because they are the only ones with a Military discount.


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## Jeff Handy (Feb 24, 2020)

http://community.homedepot.com/howt...ical-Military-Discount-Policy-906500000004mI8


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## Spicoli43 (Feb 24, 2020)

Jeff Handy said:


> http://community.homedepot.com/howt...ical-Military-Discount-Policy-906500000004mI8



Home Depot here is hit and miss. Lumber has no military discount, I wouldn't think flooring does either. If it's "consumable", there is no discount, whatever that means. I have gotten discounts on tape measures, knee pads, tool bags etc. The limit at HD is $50.

I bought all the Cedar planks, 2x4's, Brackets etc. for a long section of my fence at Lowe's, and the discount ended up being around $250.


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## rbm328 (Feb 24, 2020)

Spicoli43, i do believe that LL's gassing problem has been resolved as we had absolutely NO problems with our floor and we did a 15'x15' den, 11'x11' front living room, entry way and hallway to our bedrooms with absolutely no smell.
as for lowes, i used to work there PT.  they have standard brands, but sometimes not all same lot # or not enough boxes or corporate didn't get off their a** and order the correct items.

as for LL, they weren't pushy and extremely helpful.  they also do military discount (i'm retired uscg).  i believe they also have sub-contractors that install, but we had someone. next house, we'll go back with LL.
you said you didn't have any LL around you.  my closest stores were all an hour+ away (I live in NE Alabama) but we visited all of them (to see if any had different items. and yes, some did).

i'll try post some pics for ya

hth
rich


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## Spicoli43 (Feb 25, 2020)

That looks great, Rich. The nearest LL is 500 miles away in Idaho. There is other flooring places here, but for everything I can find at Lowe's, all the other joints are wickedly expensive. I'll probably check them out anyway, but even Costco is much more expensive than Lowe's.

I can tell there isn't a whole lot of brain activity at Lowe's corporate based on my experiences. Anybody can tell that to some degree when they check out (The 1970's computer program). The managers here are great, the only exception they don't make is Brickseek items that the store 100 miles away has for cheaper. I don't expect them to match those prices though. 

Aaron


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## Spicoli43 (Jun 28, 2020)

I have decided on Wellmade Golden Arowana Sandalwood from Costco because I got a sample from them, and it's solid, better than I expected. It also has underlayment attached, at the in warehouse price of $1.90 sf, and is the same color as my cat. Now to the questions. 

First is an opinion, would you do the entire common areas with one shade, and the bathrooms with a slightly different shade, as in the pic? I have enough for the bathrooms and laundry room in a different color, but don't know the reaction of a perspective buyer. 

Second is what I should do where the LVP will meet the bathtub. Besides gluing that first piece down, then caulking, I can't think of anything else? 

Thanks.


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## mabloodhound (Jun 29, 2020)

I would NOT do the bathroom in a different color if it abuts the other room(s).  Just my opinion.


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## Spicoli43 (Jun 29, 2020)

mabloodhound said:


> I would NOT do the bathroom in a different color if it abuts the other room(s).  Just my opinion.



Ok, what about bedrooms?


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## Sparky617 (Jun 29, 2020)

Some guys from our church and I just installed a bunch in our new assistant pastor's house.  We did about 800 square feet of it on the entire first floor.  We used the same flooring for all the rooms, MBR, master bath, kitchen, dining, half bath, living room and entry way.   We did need to use transition strips in a few places as the kitchen and bathrooms were different heights. We also used them were we had to change the direction we laid the floor.  It all runs the same (east/west) direction, but we had to reverse the direction (tongue v groove) we laid it.  Trying to install it backwards is difficult.

The more expensive the product the easier installation goes. 

We had some installed in a large classroom at church.  It does seem to scratch easily there with chairs and tables being dragged across it.  The room is large and loud.  I wanted to install commercial carpet in that room to soak up the noise, but was over-ruled.  Turns out I was right, we'll probably install carpet in that room at some point.  Being a large open room hard surfaces on all four walls, a hard floor and drywall ceiling there isn't much to absorb sound.  Not usually a problem in a house with upholstered furniture and other stuff to absorb the sound.


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## Spicoli43 (Jun 29, 2020)

Sparky617 said:


> Some guys from our church and I just installed a bunch in our new assistant pastor's house.  We did about 800 square feet of it on the entire first floor.  We used the same flooring for all the rooms, MBR, master bath, kitchen, dining, half bath, living room and entry way.   We did need to use transition strips in a few places as the kitchen and bathrooms were different heights. We also used them were we had to change the direction we laid the floor.  It all runs the same (east/west) direction, but we had to reverse the direction (tongue v groove) we laid it.  Trying to install it backwards is difficult.
> 
> The more expensive the product the easier installation goes.
> 
> We had some installed in a large classroom at church.  It does seem to scratch easily there with chairs and tables being dragged across it.  The room is large and loud.  I wanted to install commercial carpet in that room to soak up the noise, but was over-ruled.  Turns out I was right, we'll probably install carpet in that room at some point.  Being a large open room hard surfaces on all four walls, a hard floor and drywall ceiling there isn't much to absorb sound.  Not usually a problem in a house with upholstered furniture and other stuff to absorb the sound.



I could do all one shade, but then I have the extra color, probably 700 sf of it.

I would put in that flat carpeting in the classroom. I don't even know if it's called carpet.


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## Sparky617 (Jun 29, 2020)

Spicoli43 said:


> I could do all one shade, but then I have the extra color, probably 700 sf of it.
> 
> I would put in that flat carpeting in the classroom. I don't even know if it's called carpet.


I wanted to put in a low pile commercial carpeting or carpet squares in the classroom.  I lost the battle, though everyone agrees we should have gone with carpet due to the noise factor.  At some point we'll probably cover over the LVT with carpet.  The building was built in 1967 so the original floor was asbestos tile.  At some point it was covered with VCT (vinyl composite tile).  To avoid having to do an abatement we left it all in place and covered it all with the LVT.

I like the continuity of having one type of floor.  We have hardwoods on our first floor, stairway and upstairs hallway.  For now we have carpet in the bedrooms and bonus room.  I'm considering replacing the bonus room carpet with hardwoods.  I use it as my home office and carpet doesn't work with office chairs.  I may do hardwoods in our master bedroom at the same time.


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## Spicoli43 (Jun 29, 2020)

Sparky617 said:


> I wanted to put in a low pile commercial carpeting or carpet squares in the classroom.  I lost the battle, though everyone agrees we should have gone with carpet due to the noise factor.  At some point we'll probably cover over the LVT with carpet.  The building was built in 1967 so the original floor was asbestos tile.  At some point it was covered with VCT (vinyl composite tile).  To avoid having to do an abatement we left it all in place and covered it all with the LVT.
> 
> I like the continuity of having one type of floor.  We have hardwoods on our first floor, stairway and upstairs hallway.  For now we have carpet in the bedrooms and bonus room.  I'm considering replacing the bonus room carpet with hardwoods.  I use it as my home office and carpet doesn't work with office chairs.  I may do hardwoods in our master bedroom at the same time.



Ok, well it sounds like you are running into the same situation, as replacing the carpet with hardwood will result in a different color, correct? As far as the church, I would get carpet remnants for where the chairs and tables go. That or scrap everything and have all new carpet put in. 

Now that I'm really thinking about it though, people won't refuse to buy because I have all one color throughout. I'm over thinking it.


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## Sparky617 (Jun 30, 2020)

We had a large remnant that we had  cut in half, bound and made into two area rugs.  That has helped a bit with the noise. 

On the uniform floors thoughout a house, I think a little variety is ok.  On our pastor's house there were four types of flooring on the first floor.  That was a bit excessive.  With LVP you can do a unified floor throughout.  If you have carpet I don't think anyone would object to something else in the kitchen and bathroom.


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## Spicoli43 (Jun 30, 2020)

Sparky617 said:


> We had a large remnant that we had  cut in half, bound and made into two area rugs.  That has helped a bit with the noise.
> 
> On the uniform floors thoughout a house, I think a little variety is ok.  On our pastor's house there were four types of flooring on the first floor.  That was a bit excessive.  With LVP you can do a unified floor throughout.  If you have carpet I don't think anyone would object to something else in the kitchen and bathroom.



Yeah, I'm still thinking about new carpet in all the bedrooms at the last minute, after all my stuff is in storage. 

How would you install LVP in the bathroom, up against the tub?


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## Sparky617 (Jun 30, 2020)

In the couple of installations I've done (volunteer work, not a pro) we have handled it two ways.  First was to caulk the joint after carefully cutting the profile of the LVP to the tub.  We used white caulk to match the tub.  At the pastor's house we used quarter round as we did in the rest of the room.  That was what she wanted.  Quarter round is certainly easier than carefully scribbing the joint.

I'm contemplating what to do when I replace the carpet in our bedrooms.  In my house's price range hardwoods or carpet are common.   With the hallway having hardwoods I can do each bedroom differently or separately since there is the hardwood buffer between rooms.  Our hardwoods are oak finished in place so matching the existing isn't hard.  And since the joints will be at the doors having a transition strip isn't unsightly so I don't have to weave the new into the old and refinish all of the floors when I do the bedrooms.


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## Spicoli43 (Jun 30, 2020)

Sparky617 said:


> In the couple of installations I've done (volunteer work, not a pro) we have handled it two ways.  First was to caulk the joint after carefully cutting the profile of the LVP to the tub.  We used white caulk to match the tub.  At the pastor's house we used quarter round as we did in the rest of the room.  That was what she wanted.  Quarter round is certainly easier than carefully scribbing the joint.
> 
> I'm contemplating what to do when I replace the carpet in our bedrooms.  In my house's price range hardwoods or carpet are common.   With the hallway having hardwoods I can do each bedroom differently or separately since there is the hardwood buffer between rooms.  Our hardwoods are oak finished in place so matching the existing isn't hard.  And since the joints will be at the doors having a transition strip isn't unsightly so I don't have to weave the new into the old and refinish all of the floors when I do the bedrooms.



Thanks, I wasn't thinking about quarter round, but it would have to be small against the tub, not the normal size that would be against a staircase. Or, maybe I'm just making that up, but I see it in my head. 

Another benefit to the same color throughout and no carpet is no transition strips. Not that they are difficult, just a step not needed.


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## MrMiz (Jun 30, 2020)

I've done a lot of LVP. In my rentals along with my personal residence and private residences. CoreTech, LifeProof and a couple of others. I returned on brand I didn't like about 10 years ago ( I can't remember the name so I won't bad mouth the company unless I'm sure), but it's completely changed since then. I know you already made your choice but I'm going to through this out there for the next guy.

I ALWAYS buy the kind with the underlayment already attached, and it has to be 100% waterproof. I won't even look at if if it doesn't meet those 2 criteria. My reasoning is : underlayment is a royal pain... it's a lot less work if it's already attached. 100% water proof because in my option this type of things fail because of moisture. Moisture in the subfloor, moisture from the room it's in, accidental moisture etc. So since using only 100% water proof with underlayment attached I haven't had to replace a plank yet. The previous stuff I've had to replace a lot of for various reasons. Leaking dishwasher... rising water level causing the concrete to wick more... even a simple spill has damage the other non 100% water proof kind. I've installed in every location you can think of... even a shed.

For a bathroom install against a tub I silicone the tub to the subfloor, when I lay out the floor I make sure I have a minimum of 2 inch plank at the tub. When I get to the tub I lay the piece perfectly lined up with the previous piece and I take short piece (around 12") and trim off the under side tounge... removing what I expect the gap between the tub and floor to be. Then I use the short cut off as a scribe and drag a line across the plank that is perfectly lined up with the previous row. It should only take you one or 2 tries to get the gap between the tub and the last plank perfect buy "editing"  your scribe plank. Then when I have it laid and done I tape the plank close to 1/8" from the edge of the plank with painters tape and caulk with white silicone and right after I smooth I pull the tape. Make sure you only use enough silicone to fill the gap it really should minimally smear on the tape. If it does just make sure it's thin before you pull the tape because it will make a small ridge in the silicone. It doesn't look bad with the small ridge it just looks better when is just a perfect line. You want the gap between your tub and plank to be right at 1/8" if you can for the best performance for both the silicone and to allow a little expansion and contraction though in my experience the 100% water proof stuff has little to no expansion. You just want to maintain it because the manufacturer recommends it.

It always cracks me up when I see those warnings that you shouldn't install it in a room that has heavy furniture. Like you've check the weigh rating on your couch or something. It's also funny because most people install it under toilets, and vanities, or set a door on top of it. None of the 100% water proof stuff I've installed has buckled yet and I've put it under everything. Even under cabinets and then installed them at the request of a family member and that's been like that for 5 years with no failures. I don't think it would be something I would do or recommend to everybody, but it worked in this case and that's what they wanted and couldn't be swayed from.

The one thing I could see is sun exposure damaging it (though I haven't seen it happen yet) however sun exposure alters just about every other kind of flooring too. I just installed a bunch last week in the mountains. It will be interesting if I see anything noticeable in it at high altitude and the extreme difference in temp than where I normally install. We'll see cuz I'll have to fix it if I do.

Hope that helps.

Edit - for got to mention I actually really LOVE being able to do different kinds/colors in different rooms. Even alternating colors can have results I like sometimes. I haven't done a pattern in it yet, but I would love to. Like a square boarder around a room. I'm sure somebody will release a brand with it already built into the picture on the plank soon. That being said for resale value NEVER change colors. Stick with one and do it throughout. Colors are a personal preference and only about 10% of the population can visualize change in a home. If you alternate colors on them their brains literally check out because they can't visualize anything other than what they see. The same goes for painting. I can't tell you how many people I've dealt with can't even grasp a different color than what's already on the wall in front of them. Whenever I paint I always paint one full wall and then have them come and take a look before I do anything else. I've saved myself weeks of work by doing this.

Edit 2 - another tip. If you run into trouble with not being able to adjust your floor laterally you can put down a strip of painters tap and stomp it in the direction you want it to go and it will slide laterally. Only works for about 3 planks, but it works really good when your stuck and can't get a tool on an edge.


I have about another 2000 sq ft. of this to go. 2 different colors. Those pictures are of the thinner "cheaper" stuff in the basement. The stuff on the main floor is full thickness and planks are about 9" wide 4' long.


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## Spicoli43 (Jun 30, 2020)

Thanks for the tips, MrMiz!


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## Jim_in_JAX_FLA (Jul 1, 2020)

Sparky617 said:


> We had a large remnant that we had  cut in half, bound and made into two area rugs.  That has helped a bit with the noise.
> 
> On the uniform floors thoughout a house, I think a little variety is ok.  On our pastor's house there were four types of flooring on the first floor.  That was a bit excessive.  With LVP you can do a unified floor throughout.  If you have carpet I don't think anyone would object to something else in the kitchen and bathroom.



can you give me an idea of what the carpet remnant binding cost ??   I have some remnants of outdoor carpet, and want to have some runners bound to go across the high traffic areas....  THANKS !!!    JJ in Jacksonville, FL


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## Sparky617 (Jul 1, 2020)

Jim_in_JAX_FLA said:


> can you give me an idea of what the carpet remnant binding cost ??   I have some remnants of outdoor carpet, and want to have some runners bound to go across the high traffic areas....  THANKS !!!    JJ in Jacksonville, FL


Not sure, the vendor did it for free.  They had a pretty large contract with the church for both the carpet and the flooring.  Probably $1 a foot or more, but I really have no idea.


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## Jim_in_JAX_FLA (Jul 1, 2020)

ok, thanks !!!


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## Spicoli43 (Aug 14, 2020)

Ok, I'm finally done with my first room. I had to take off the door jambs, there was no way around that. My issue now is baseboards. I have decades of experience in destroying things, but never took off baseboards carefully before. Didn't work, most need replacing. 

What I want to do is get some MDF and make my own, but it won't be in 12 or 16 ft. lengths, more like 8 at the most. Has anybody put 2 boards together and made it look good?


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## MrMiz (Aug 14, 2020)

yup. I cut it at an angle at the ends, glue it together so the joint is pretty much seemless and then shoot it on. I've tried other methods of joining like biscuts, and various joints, but if your going with MDF your going to paint it anyway so just glue it and sand it to finish.

This is what I do in rooms over 12' anyway as most of the home centers have it in 12' sticks.


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## Sparky617 (Aug 14, 2020)

Too late now, but with an Oscillating saw you can cut off the bottom of the door jambs and slide the LVP under the jamb and trim.

For your baseboards, you can cut the joints on a 45 (vertically) so the pieces overlap.  It is done all the time when you have to do a joint in any trim.  It is better than a flat butt joint.


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## Spicoli43 (Aug 14, 2020)

MrMiz said:


> yup. I cut it at an angle at the ends, glue it together so the joint is pretty much seemless and then shoot it on. I've tried other methods of joining like biscuts, and various joints, but if your going with MDF your going to paint it anyway so just glue it and sand it to finish.
> 
> This is what I do in rooms over 12' anyway as most of the home centers have it in 12' sticks.



Cool, Thanks. Good to know it can be done.


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## Spicoli43 (Aug 14, 2020)

Sparky617 said:


> Too late now, but with an Oscillating saw you can cut off the bottom of the door jambs and slide the LVP under the jamb and trim.
> 
> For your baseboards, you can cut the joints on a 45 (vertically) so the pieces overlap.  It is done all the time when you have to do a joint in any trim.  It is better than a flat butt joint.



Thanks, I'll do the 45. Have to figure out the router part now. 

I can't do the Oscillating saw because it will leave too much of a gap. It's not TIG flooring, I have to elevate the new piece to click into the other, at a minimum of probably 25 degrees. Other jambs might be different, this was just the first.


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## Sparky617 (Aug 15, 2020)

Spicoli43 said:


> Thanks, I'll do the 45. Have to figure out the router part now.
> 
> I can't do the Oscillating saw because it will leave too much of a gap. It's not TIG flooring, I have to elevate the new piece to click into the other, at a minimum of probably 25 degrees. Other jambs might be different, this was just the first.


I've installed it, you need to use your tapping block to force it together.  You can do it without getting it 25 degrees.


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## Spicoli43 (Aug 15, 2020)

Sparky617 said:


> I've installed it, you need to use your tapping block to force it together.  You can do it without getting it 25 degrees.


It doesn't want to work that way with scraps. I'll try it on the next door, though. It will save a boatload of time if so.


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## Spicoli43 (Aug 15, 2020)

Now to the bathroom, I figured this would be my only time to figure out if I could trace a funky persistent smell to the sub floor, and hopefully I did. Now, there is 2 ways I see to take care of that bad portion in the floor. 

1) Remove the sink cabinet, which has Pex fittings that I haven't seen before, so shut off the well and hope I figure it out. Then cut a whole new sub floor. (The cabinet is in near perfect condition)

2) Use a Circular saw and cut around the damaged part and replace it, along with the toilet hardware. 

The linoleum glue smell might not go away anyway if I put the vinyl on top of it. 

What would you do?


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## MrMiz (Aug 16, 2020)

That looks to me like someone put a 1/8 chip board over the top of the sub floor, maybe even over another layer of vinyl. Which was pretty common in my area in the late 70's and 80's. If it was me I would replace the floor down to the studs.  IF your house is 70's or 80's then suit and mask up, seal off, and filter and exhaust the air as you work... If you can't guess why I am saying that then you should not proceed.


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## Spicoli43 (Aug 16, 2020)

MrMiz said:


> That looks to me like someone put a 1/8 chip board over the top of the sub floor, maybe even over another layer of vinyl. Which was pretty common in my area in the late 70's and 80's. If it was me I would replace the floor down to the studs.  IF your house is 70's or 80's then suit and mask up, seal off, and filter and exhaust the air as you work... If you can't guess why I am saying that then you should not proceed.



Thanks, but I have lived in 70's houses as a kid. I won't do that again. It's 2006, MDF.


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## Spicoli43 (Aug 30, 2020)

Well, I took the sub floor out, and there is no way to replace it. I put in a piece of plywood along with a scrap of the vinyl, and compared the height to what the vinyl would be in the hallway. With the transition strip, it's just not possible. It would create an instant trip hazard. 

I'm at the start of the other bathroom now in the pic, and I know the industry standard to use sub floors in bathrooms pre dates widespread use of wood / vinyl plank, but I'm struggling to figure out why they would use it? Taking it out isn't breaking my heart, it just takes a long time.


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