# Tricky floorplanwhere do I start?



## zepper (Jan 4, 2017)

Hey guys,

I'm about to install an engineered hardwood floor in our home's main level. It's a tongue-in-groove floating floor (boards glued to each other) with foam underlayment over a wood sub-floor.

The thing is, it's a pretty open plan, and I'm not sure where to start so everything will line up:







I'm flooring the areas in white, boards going horizontally. (This isn't to scale, BTW.) 

It's important that the boards be aligned with the upper hall wall and adjacent stairwell, which are in the middle. For that reason, should I install the first row along the hall wall, then work my way out to the front and back of the house? If so, how can I anchor the first row, going across the open area, so more rows can be tapped in against it?

Also, the floor maker says the boards should be attached by turning a board upside-down, running a bead of glue along the top of its groove, then turning it right-side up so the adhesive spreads more evenly as you tap it in against the previous board's tongue. But if I start in the middle of the house, I'll be able to do that with only half the boards, as the other half will have their grooves facing me instead of their tongues.

For _that_ reason, I wouldn't mind starting in the front areas&#8212;lower hall, foyer, family room&#8212;and working toward the back. But how could I be sure the rows were aligned with each other when they met (_and_ were aligned with the upper hall)?

Thanks very much for your advice!


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## nealtw (Jan 4, 2017)

There would be very little difference in gluing the tongue or the grove.


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## zepper (Jan 5, 2017)

I asked about this on one other forum. They recommended I install the first row along the hall wall, snap a chalk line even with that through the width of the house, then screw down scrap-wood guides to hold the rest of the row in place. That makes sense. It'll be much easier working out from the center than trying to make everything match going the other way. 



nealtw said:


> There would be very little difference in gluing the tongue or the grove.



You may be right; I'm just going by what the floor co. recommends.

Someone pointed out that I could glue a spline into the groove on the other side of the first row to create a tongue there. I haven't found out if it's something you can buy (sounds like a small molding) or if you need to make it yourself.

Well, I feel like that covers it (no pun intended). I thought I'd add these details in case anyone else ran into a similar situation. Thanks for your attention!


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## nealtw (Jan 5, 2017)

zepper said:


> I asked about this on one other forum. They recommended I install the first row along the hall wall, snap a chalk line even with that through the width of the house, then screw down scrap-wood guides to hold the rest of the row in place. That makes sense. It'll be much easier working out from the center than trying to make everything match going the other way.
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Most times people cut the own, you could cut one side of flooring for that, you will likely be cutting at the walls anyway so you don't have to be wasting that piece.


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## bud16415 (Jan 5, 2017)

I put down about 600 sq ft once that was all T&G and glued my rooms and hall were quite like yours in how they interconnected. I wanted one solid uninterrupted area and the flooring company highly recommended breaking it up and using transition pieces. I went for the one piece and it worked out well and has been down now for over 20 years. 

What I found is the accuracy has to be perfect and the joints have to be glued tight or problems in the installation will multiply as you go. For that reason I glued and wedged every piece by making wedges I could screw to the floor and then use a wedge cut on a scrap of flooring I could tap in to close the joint giving the glue a chance to set. It took a bit longer doing that but was worth the effort. 

It can be laid both direction just a slightly different method of getting the glue in the joint. I wouldn&#8217;t mess with the spline as some of the flooring shows a direction when down. I would start at the upper hall I think and work out in both directions. That first row and several rows should be dry fitted and backed up against a solid strip screwed to the floor to get a straight start and have something to wedge against. As I tapped the wedges in I would watch for glue to bead out the crack and wipe it off. That way I knew I had 100% seal and you will see any gap. 

Getting that first starter strip perfect will be the key. 

After I got mine done and was back at the flooring retailer buying some trim the owner asked if I had success with one big area. I invited him out to have a look and he walked around for a long time looking for a gap. He then offered me a job as an installer. I declined telling him my knees could only take doing this once every 10 years. By the way get good quality knee pads before you start.


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## zepper (Jan 5, 2017)

Hey guysthanks for your extra input on this, I really appreciate it.



nealtw said:


> [re spline] Most times people cut [their] own, you could cut one side of flooring for that, you will likely be cutting at the walls anyway so you don't have to be wasting that piece.



I thought of that, but unfortunately that'd give me a piece as wide as only one tongue, and a double width is prob. best. I don't have a band saw though, just a table saw, and I don't think it'd have the patience for something that precise... I'll figure it out though.



bud16415 said:


> I put down about 600 sq ft once that was all T&G and glued my rooms and hall were quite like yours in how they interconnected. I wanted one solid uninterrupted area and the flooring company highly recommended breaking it up and using transition pieces. I went for the one piece and it worked out well and has been down now for over 20 years.



That's definitely the best way for separate rooms. I'd sure like to use some, but it my case it's basically all one continuous area. So I'll leave what perimeter space I can and stay positive.



bud16415 said:


> What I found is the accuracy has to be perfect and the joints have to be glued tight or problems in the installation will multiply as you go. For that reason I glued and wedged every piece by making wedges I could screw to the floor and then use a wedge cut on a scrap of flooring I could tap in to close the joint giving the glue a chance to set. It took a bit longer doing that but was worth the effort.



Yeah, that really sounds like the best way. This flooring's supposed to be made very accurately and fit easily, but I'll have tapping stuff on hand, you can be sure. And I've got a #@$!-load of painter's tape to hold each 2 or 3 rows together till they dry. Anyway, thanks for the heads-up on the fit, that's v. important.



bud16415 said:


> It can be laid both direction just a slightly different method of getting the glue in the joint. I wouldnt mess with the spline as some of the flooring shows a direction when down.



Man, I doubt would've thought of that at any point. I scrutinized some of my boards now, and it looks like the grains aren't directional (even in the same board). But you're right, that wouldn't always be true.



bud16415 said:


> I would start at the upper hall I think and work out in both directions. That first row and several rows should be dry fitted and backed up against a solid strip screwed to the floor to get a straight start and have something to wedge against. As I tapped the wedges in I would watch for glue to bead out the crack and wipe it off. That way I knew I had 100% seal and you will see any gap... Getting that first starter strip perfect will be the key.



Excellent. It sure helps to have such a vivid mental image.  :?)



bud16415 said:


> After I got mine done and was back at the flooring retailer buying some trim the owner asked if I had success with one big area. I invited him out to have a look and he walked around for a long time looking for a gap. He then offered me a job as an installer. I declined telling him my knees could only take doing this once every 10 years.



LOL, great story! Some of the most amazing work I've seen was done by people who knew they'll be seeing the results every day (not to mention, their partners/family seeing it). That's good motivation.



bud16415 said:


> By the way get good quality knee pads before you start.



Thanks for reminding me; I'm adding them to the list right now. Who knows, I may even be able to walk again when this is done.


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## nealtw (Jan 5, 2017)

zepper said:


> Hey guysthanks for your extra input on this, I really appreciate it.
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The table saw is the right tool.
Rip the tongue off then set the fence to the thickness of the spine and raise the blade to double the width of the tongue.  Run it thru with bottom of the board against the fence. Then set the fence at double the width of the tongue and lower the blade to the thickness of the tongue. And make the second cut.
You have a spline and if needed you still have a board you can use against the far wall.


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