# Powder Room in a bad spot, what to do?



## DenisTheThief

Our Powder Room is right beside our dining room. It's a bad spot. We are trying to decide what to do. We are thinking about switching the Laundry Room and the Powder Room. These 2 rooms are beside each other. This would involve some plumbing, maybe $350, since our basement is unfinished, luckily the ceiling access is easy. We currently have 1 full bathroom, upstairs.

We have 3 options:

1. Switch the Powder Room and the Laundry room. The cost would not be cheap since some plumbing and electrical work would be required. Also we would need to tear-down a small interior wall of about 50" and erect one of about 60". This would require a permit, I believe. But the drywall and painting I could do myself.

2. Turn the Powder Room into a Pantry and finish the Bathroom in the basement. We already have the rough-in in the basement and I can install ceramic myself. This would cost a little more than option #1 I think. But add more value to the home. Except, not having a toilet on the main floor could be a turn-off to potential buyers down the road. 

3. Switch the Powder Room and the Laundry room and finish the Bathroom in the basement. This of course is the ideal solution but also the most costly.


Any opinions on which route to take?
What is more of a turn-off do you think, not having a toilet on the main floor, or having a toilet right beside the dining room?
Does having a small pantry on the main floor appeal to anyone?


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## slownsteady

I think that a powder room on the main floor is a "must". I don't know how often you entertain, but having a parade run upstairs where the bedrooms may not be tidy enough seems a bit awkward, and seniors may not be able to get around so well. Basement bathrooms are handy, but again, basements tend to be less convenient to others.


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## Sparky617

Our powder room is in the hallway between the kitchen and the dining room at the top of the basement stairs.  So it isn't technically in either room.  I would consider no powder room on the first floor a bigger negative than one that is near the dining room.


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## slownsteady

Can you just move the door to another wall?


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## nealtw

I would finish the bath in the basement so when the dining room is in use, people have a choice.


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## DenisTheThief

slownsteady said:


> Can you just move the door to another wall?



Thanks! No. One wall is the garage, the other the stairs, the other the laundry room. I've added an image to show roughly the layout.


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## nealtw

That's not the worst I have seen. Imagine the powder room on the side of the table and people have to move to let some one into the door that opened out.

So what exactly is the complaint, noise, visual or?


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## DenisTheThief

nealtw said:


> That's not the worst I have seen. Imagine the powder room on the side of the table and people have to move to let some one into the door that opened out.
> 
> So what exactly is the complaint, noise, visual or?



It's just embarrassing for us when we have company over. I wouldn't say 'noise' but you can hear it. And even just being at the dining table and seeing people enter and exit the powder room. People can use the upstairs bathroom. But obviously we don't want to ask them to use the upstairs one.


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## nealtw

DenisTheThief said:


> It's just embarrassing for us when we have company over. I wouldn't say 'noise' but you can hear it. And even just being at the dining table and seeing people enter and exit the powder room. People can use the upstairs bathroom. But obviously we don't want to ask them to use the upstairs one.



But just moving it to where the washer is, still puts people in the same hall way.
Not enough upside to that move.


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## nealtw

I would not like to use a bathroom with a bunch of people close by but at the same time I don't feel comfortable wondering upstairs in some else's house. And as that is your personal space you should not feel comfortable with everyone going upstairs. But if I know there is a bathroom in the basement, that is where you find me. But for the other 15 hrs of the day, that bathroom would be handy enough.
I would do up the basement bathroom and when company comes over remember to point out that they should check the new handy work in the basement and after that everyone knows where it is.


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## Sparky617

Put in a white noise generator and run it when you have guests over.  If you were up for it insulate the walls and weather strip the door to cut down on noise.  For insulation you could blow in recycled cellulose fiber with the machine from your local big box home improvement store.  It would only require a couple of 1.5 - 2" round holes using a hole saw on a drill.  Packed cellulose would do a better job at noise reduction than fiberglass.  A solid door would be better than a hollow core door as well.

White Noise Generators

https://www.amazon.com/white-noise-generator/s?ie=UTF8&page=1&rh=i%3Aaps%2Ck%3Awhite%20noise%20generator


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## bud16415

In General I was taught the doorway for a Powder room should not be visible from the seating locations in a dining or living room area. On the same token it should be close by and in a formal setting never in the personal areas of the home. 

I dont know if your sketch is to scale or not but it looks like a little wall coming off the powder room wall would accomplish that or even a wall with a L in it.


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## DenisTheThief

nealtw said:


> But just moving it to where the washer is, still puts people in the same hall way.
> Not enough upside to that move.



I'm afraid of that. I agree it's not much of a move distance-wise. Then again, with respect to the dining table, now there would be the kitchen wall in between - whereas currently there is nothing.

I guess like anything, it will come down to the cost of doing it...


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## DenisTheThief

bud16415 said:


> In General I was taught the doorway for a Powder room should not be visible from the seating locations in a dining or living room area. On the same token it should be close by and in a formal setting never in the personal areas of the home.
> 
> I dont know if your sketch is to scale or not but it looks like a little wall coming off the powder room wall would accomplish that or even a wall with a L in it.



Yes, I agree with that principle.

It's not quite to scale but not far off either. I can't build a wall off the powder room. Because to the left of it is the stairs. So it would either cut into the stairs or that little hallway.

But that does lead me to an idea I never thought of! I could extend the kitchen wall. I can't extend it too far as there is not a lot of room. And it would cut down a little bit of the light going into the dining room. But it would address the problem a little and it is a low-cost option.


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## bud16415

There you go.

Just so others can picture it here is what i suggested wall A and your idea wall B.


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## Sparky617

What direction do the stairs run in your picture?   Would wall B restrict access to them?

Also, with respect to the noise generator I mentioned earlier, put it on the lighting circuit so it turns on automatically.  Or, wire the fan so it comes on with the light.  Unless you have a really quiet bathroom fan, they usually make enough noise to mask the sound.


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## DenisTheThief

bud16415 said:


> There you go.
> 
> Just so others can picture it here is what i suggested wall A and your idea wall B.



Thanks. Your wall (A) is tempting. But that hallway is 4-feet wide. So I don't think it's enough room to do it.


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## slownsteady

I'm wondering if you would gain any advantage just from changing the swing of the door, so that it helps block any view. If the door is hollow, you would have the chance to change or insulate at the same time.


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## DenisTheThief

Sparky617 said:


> What direction do the stairs run in your picture?   Would wall B restrict access to them?
> 
> Also, with respect to the noise generator I mentioned earlier, put it on the lighting circuit so it turns on automatically.  Or, wire the fan so it comes on with the light.  Unless you have a really quiet bathroom fan, they usually make enough noise to mask the sound.



No, wall B wouldn't restrict access to the stairs. Just make the area less open and a little less natural light.

To the left of the power room is the stairs going down. And left of that is the stairs going up. It's one of those multi-level designs.

Good point, the fan does help with masking the sound.


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## nealtw

Burn the table, they will have something else to think about.


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## bud16415

nealtw said:


> Burn the table, they will have something else to think about.



Burning a table is an awful aggressive solution to having dinner guests over. The smell of burning tables does cover the smell of other things though.  :down::hide:


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## bud16415

Does powder room door open in or out?

Extending wall B 3 might make a huge difference and maybe making wall A just come straight out 1.

I would tape some cardboard or something up and see how it looks


One last idea as long as Im brain storming here. Make wall A come all the way across and put a door in it. maybe a double swinging split partial door.


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## DenisTheThief

bud16415 said:


> Does powder room door open in or out?
> 
> Extending wall B 3 might make a huge difference and maybe making wall A just come straight out 1.
> 
> I would tape some cardboard or something up and see how it looks
> 
> 
> One last idea as long as Im brain storming here. Make wall A come all the way across and put a door in it. maybe a double swinging split partial door.



Actually a swinging door is a good idea, I never thought of. It cuts down the visibility. And a full door would be too many doors. I found a good example:

http://www.wearefound.com/house-with-swinging-doors/


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## bud16415

DenisTheThief said:


> Actually a swinging door is a good idea, I never thought of. It cuts down the visibility. And a full door would be too many doors. I found a good example:
> 
> http://www.wearefound.com/house-with-swinging-doors/



I like that style of door for that application also. Some of that type door can be made to open with a full swing in or out. That would be nice when you are making frequent trips to the laundry etc. and when you have company or wish the privacy just close them. 

Would be a lot simpler than switching 2 rooms around and the plumbing involved.


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## DenisTheThief

So if we were to switch the laundry room and powder room, I may need to get a building permit. The city says, removing a load bearing wall requires a permit. Is it hard to determine if a wall is a load bearing wall? Also, it's only about 4'. And while I will be removing a 4' wall, I'll also be erecting a 4' wall.


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## nealtw

DenisTheThief said:


> So if we were to switch the laundry room and powder room, I may need to get a building permit. The city says, removing a load bearing wall requires a permit. Is it hard to determine if a wall is a load bearing wall? Also, it's only about 4'. And while I will be removing a 4' wall, I'll also be erecting a 4' wall.



You will want plumbing, and wiring permits so an inspection on framing is not a big deal.


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## DenisTheThief

Any opinions on weather or not I need the permits? I know that's kind of a weird question.

It's just that this wouldn't be a major change. And as long as the job gets done correctly, when I go to sell the house some day it will pass the home inspection.


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## nealtw

Permits are there for a purpose. Besides just a money grab and causing delays by waiting for inspections.
They are there to protect you from a dumb home owner, dumb contractor and purposely dangerous contractor.

So I will just ask some questions that should be answered before you do anything.
Who decides if it is a load bearing wall?
What have you found if you open a load bearing wall and find 2 or more studs nailed together for no apparent reason?
Is it okay to re route the  power cable going to the dryer, if it is long enough?
If not where will you be putting a junction box, if that is allowed?
Do you have a plan for the dryer vent?
Do you have a plan on how to get the toilet drain over there and a lager vent stack if needed?


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## zannej

Denis, have you considered just putting in a tension rod with a curtain on it to block the view of the bathroom door from the guests in the dining room? When guests are not around and you want to have it open for people to go in and out, you can just tether the curtains open and out of the way. 

And maybe you can play soft music when your guests are over to drown out any sounds from the bathroom.

Another alternative is a decorative standing privacy screen that can be folded up and/or moved out of the way when you need to haul laundry.

I know it is a simple solution, but it is cheaper and less of a headache than trying to switch the powder room and laundry room. 

That said, I would still try to finish the basement bathroom as well. That way guests could have two options.

Having a full door that has to be opened to access the hallway might make guests feel awkward if they are expected to go through it to access the bathroom. But a curtain or screen might make it seem less private.

Or another option would be to get very tall bookcases and put them up so they are blocking the view of the bathroom door but are not blocking the passageway (if such a thing is possible). 

I hope I'm making sense.


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## DenisTheThief

nealtw said:


> Permits are there for a purpose. Besides just a money grab and causing delays by waiting for inspections.
> They are there to protect you from a dumb home owner, dumb contractor and purposely dangerous contractor.
> 
> So I will just ask some questions that should be answered before you do anything.
> Who decides if it is a load bearing wall?
> What have you found if you open a load bearing wall and find 2 or more studs nailed together for no apparent reason?
> Is it okay to re route the  power cable going to the dryer, if it is long enough?
> If not where will you be putting a junction box, if that is allowed?
> Do you have a plan for the dryer vent?
> Do you have a plan on how to get the toilet drain over there and a lager vent stack if needed?



That's a good point.

I hope to get these answers, someone's going to have a look at it, hopefully today. I think the electrical is minimum but I could be wrong. The dryer/outlet is in the corner, so it could pretty much stay there. I think the switches are fine. Just the two lights would need to be moved a foot or so.


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## KULTULZ

nealtw said:


> Permits are there for a purpose, besides just a money grab and causing delays by waiting for inspections.
> 
> They are there to protect you from a dumb home owner, dumb contractor and purposely dangerous contractor.



*!!! Hallelujah !!!*

Not to mention if something happens, the fire marshal and/or insurance carrier may have a few things to say. Cheaper to cover your a$$


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## KULTULZ

zannej said:


> And maybe you can play soft music when your guests are over to drown out any sounds from the bathroom.



*THE 1812 OVERTURE*...


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## DenisTheThief

zannej said:


> Denis, have you considered just putting in a tension rod with a curtain on it to block the view of the bathroom door from the guests in the dining room? When guests are not around and you want to have it open for people to go in and out, you can just tether the curtains open and out of the way.
> 
> And maybe you can play soft music when your guests are over to drown out any sounds from the bathroom.
> 
> Another alternative is a decorative standing privacy screen that can be folded up and/or moved out of the way when you need to haul laundry.
> 
> I know it is a simple solution, but it is cheaper and less of a headache than trying to switch the powder room and laundry room.
> 
> That said, I would still try to finish the basement bathroom as well. That way guests could have two options.
> 
> Having a full door that has to be opened to access the hallway might make guests feel awkward if they are expected to go through it to access the bathroom. But a curtain or screen might make it seem less private.
> 
> Or another option would be to get very tall bookcases and put them up so they are blocking the view of the bathroom door but are not blocking the passageway (if such a thing is possible).
> 
> I hope I'm making sense.



That's a good point. I think I'd pass on the curtain. But when you mentioned bookcase, that could work. And made me think that our China Cupboard could be moved over there. Easy and would help a bit. And part of the sides are glass so it wouldn't restrict as much daylight.


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## nealtw

Have you looked at just re-configuring the bathroom.
The hall to the laundry only needs to be 36" wide, I don't know if that gives you room at the top of the stairs for a door off the main hall or you could move the bathroom door closer to the laundry door.


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## zannej

DenisTheThief said:


> That's a good point. I think I'd pass on the curtain. But when you mentioned bookcase, that could work. And made me think that our China Cupboard could be moved over there. Easy and would help a bit. And part of the sides are glass so it wouldn't restrict as much daylight.


A china cabinet would probably be good. Then it would give guests something nice to look at as they pass it or if they see it from the dining room.


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## DenisTheThief

nealtw said:


> Have you looked at just re-configuring the bathroom.
> The hall to the laundry only needs to be 36" wide, I don't know if that gives you room at the top of the stairs for a door off the main hall or you could move the bathroom door closer to the laundry door.



There's not a lot to work with. The hallway is about 48" wide and very short. One idea is to close-off the current door to the power room and move it to inside the laundry room. So you'd have to enter the laundry room to get to it. Personally I think it's an improvement and it's low-cost but not ideal. And better than a hallway door. What is more of a turn-off, having a powder-room just off the dining room, or being forced to go through the laundry room to get to the powder room. Especially since our laundryroom is small to begin with.


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## DenisTheThief

A contractor came to have a look. He said that interior small wall is not load bearing.

He had a different idea. Leave the walls and doors as is. But move the laundry room into the powder room. And turn the laundry room into a full bath room (i.e. including shower). It's good because now we'd have 2 full bathrooms. On the other hand it would be more expensive because he was suggesting a ceramic shower. And also the laundry room would be very small. We'd need to replace our washer and dryer with stacked ones (then again our washer and dryer are 10 years old). 

Would having a full bathroom on the main floor be a bit odd? Since the main floor is very small and does not have bedrooms.


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## bud16415

We have a full bath off our kitchen that most would have made as a powder room maybe. It was put in before we bought the house and is a handicapped bathroom. The woman that was there before us became wheelchair bound and they converted a den to a bedroom for her and that is now our home theater. We like the full bath off the kitchen as the patio door in the kitchen leads right out to our hot tub and that bathroom becomes a changing room and pre shower room for guests without going to the private areas of the house. It is also nice when coming in from the garden to jump in the shower. Ours gets used a lot. another strange thing in our setup we grew to like is the laundry is entered thru the first floor bath and that is off the kitchen. It is very covenant to do laundry at the same time you are in the kitchen area. She loves the location and with the hot tub you are dealing with wet towels and such and the place they go is right there. 

It also doesn&#8217;t surprise me a contractor would find the best and most expensive solution to your problem.


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## DenisTheThief

That's interesting. Although it wouldn't apply to us. i.e. about people going outside and then needing a changeroom and going inside. Well, maybe occasionally.

OK, maybe a weird question. I suggested to the contractor he do framing, flooring, plumbing etc. But I said afterwards, I could do the drywall, taping and painting. And possibly wall ceramic if we go that route. Since I've done all that before.

Is this not a good idea, to suggest? On one hand if someone wanted to hire me to do "half" the job I might not like that. On the other hand, saving a couple hundred or couple thousand bucks never hurts.


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## nealtw

They take what they can get. And all the complaints are are about fit and finish so he can get in and out and you look after the details.


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## zannej

Here is another question: Are you the person who primarily does the laundry? If not, would the person responsible for laundry be unhappy with downsizing the laundry room?

When you say stacked washer and dryer, you mean like full size units stacked on top of one another? Or one of those smaller combo units?

Honestly, I think having to walk through someone's laundry room to get to a toilet is more awkward than seeing the powder room door from the dining room.

Do you have any photos of the hallway and powder room? I know you gave measurements and sketches, but it would help to really get a visual image of the layout and such.

Swapping the laundry room and powder room and making it a full bath would probably add value to the home for resale, but I think you also need to think about what is the most practical thing for your family's purposes. Do you really *need* a full bathroom vs having more space in the laundry room? Also, on resale of the home, some buyers might actually prefer to have a larger laundry room if there is already a powder room on the main floor-- especially if you get around to adding a full bath in the basement.

If I were in your situation, I would focus on doing the full bath in the basement, maybe get the stackable washer and dryer to make more room in the existing laundry room and see about keeping the layout the way it is and just put in the furniture to block view of the door from the dining room. Or move the dining room table so guests couldn't see the door.

But, it sounds like you've given this a lot of thought and that you want to make the changes. 

On a weird side note, have you ever tried to use Google Sketchup? There are free versions you can use to create your house layout and such and then experiment with moving/tearing out walls-- fixture placement, etc. I've been using it to plan out my reno (I'm planning to swap the original bathroom to the house & the laundry room due to space/function issues-- current bathroom layout violates building code).

Edit: I just read Neal's response and was wondering if you could just swap where the toilet and sink are and if that would make the visual less offensive? or, as he suggested, make the door swing out if there is space.


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## nealtw

If part of the problem is the visual of see the crapper when the door is open. Change the door so it opens out.


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## DenisTheThief

nealtw said:


> If part of the problem is the visual of see the crapper when the door is open. Change the door so it opens out.



That would help a little. But I think still a turn-off for visitors and potential buyers down the road.


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## DenisTheThief

zannej said:


> Here is another question: Are you the person who primarily does the laundry? If not, would the person responsible for laundry be unhappy with downsizing the laundry room?
> 
> When you say stacked washer and dryer, you mean like full size units stacked on top of one another? Or one of those smaller combo units?
> 
> Honestly, I think having to walk through someone's laundry room to get to a toilet is more awkward than seeing the powder room door from the dining room.
> 
> Do you have any photos of the hallway and powder room? I know you gave measurements and sketches, but it would help to really get a visual image of the layout and such.
> 
> Swapping the laundry room and powder room and making it a full bath would probably add value to the home for resale, but I think you also need to think about what is the most practical thing for your family's purposes. Do you really *need* a full bathroom vs having more space in the laundry room? Also, on resale of the home, some buyers might actually prefer to have a larger laundry room if there is already a powder room on the main floor-- especially if you get around to adding a full bath in the basement.
> 
> If I were in your situation, I would focus on doing the full bath in the basement, maybe get the stackable washer and dryer to make more room in the existing laundry room and see about keeping the layout the way it is and just put in the furniture to block view of the door from the dining room. Or move the dining room table so guests couldn't see the door.
> 
> But, it sounds like you've given this a lot of thought and that you want to make the changes.
> 
> On a weird side note, have you ever tried to use Google Sketchup? There are free versions you can use to create your house layout and such and then experiment with moving/tearing out walls-- fixture placement, etc. I've been using it to plan out my reno (I'm planning to swap the original bathroom to the house & the laundry room due to space/function issues-- current bathroom layout violates building code).
> 
> Edit: I just read Neal's response and was wondering if you could just swap where the toilet and sink are and if that would make the visual less offensive? or, as he suggested, make the door swing out if there is space.



A smaller laundry room is not ideal, but we'd be OK with it. Either a combo unit or small stackable. I think it's an improvement. One idea is to do the switch but extend the laundry room a little, (i.e. where the powder room is now). The current appliances would fit, so we wouldn't have to buy new ones and the full-bathroom would still be big enough...

Yes, I agree a full bathroom in the basement would be good. But our place is not that large. Probably not large enough to fit a bedroom in. So perhaps just as well to have a full bathroom on the main floor. A larger family down the road may think: well, there's not 2 full bathrooms upstairs, but going to the main floor is closer than going to the basement.

Part of the idea of the full bathroom on the main floor is to kill 2 birds with one stone: have a 2nd shower and get rid of this powder room problem. Also if we do make a full bathroom on the main floor, we could make a power room in the basement down the road.

OK, good idea, I took some photos...


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## DenisTheThief

Here's the hallway, small, not much to work with. Stairs on the left, kitchen/dining room to the right. 1st left is the evil Powder Room.


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## nealtw

DenisTheThief said:


> That would help a little. But I think still a turn-off for visitors and potential buyers down the road.



Sometimes, it is what it is.

Let's say it costs 7K to do the change. if you are looking at increasing value for end use sale. 
It also ha caused inconvenience while work was being done so even if you live there while it is done it is fair that you calculate in the cost of living out.
Hotel, food and and. 
Let's say that value is 3K.
So roughly investment is 10k. So you invest 10K, what should be expected return, 12 to 15K.
If when you bought would you or could you have paid 15K more.

My point is if you are flipping you do an awful amount of math, if you are fixing your home to be your home all you can expect at the end is a quicker sale than the same house for the same price. 

When you have someone calculate the value of a home for sale, they look at the hood, the age, the number of beds and baths and sq. ft. so yours will be the same value as that other house.


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## DenisTheThief

Here is the laundry room, not very spacious in terms of going through it to the powder room. Then again doable and if we keep it tidy, I think it's an improvement.


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## DenisTheThief

Here's the view from the Dining Table. Ooo yuck, what a turn-off.


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## nealtw

I am all for changing things up, but as a cheapskate, always look for the cheapest as I am a little lazy want to find the easiest.
One of you first post you have a sketch, can you put measurement to that length and width of both rooms?

I think some one said something about moving laundry down stairs? Have you given that thought or is it out for sure. Could you live with out laundry sink?


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## slownsteady

Since moving a piece of furniture is at no cost and not doing any damage, try that first. If you like it, boom, you're done. And if you don't, you just move it back and try something else.
As much as I like the idea of changing the swing of the door, it does create a small hazard of nailing someone who may be passing the door at the moment it opens. And one would have to close the door first, before stepping around it.


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## nealtw

slownsteady said:


> Since moving a piece of furniture is at no cost and not doing any damage, try that first. If you like it, boom, you're done. And if you don't, you just move it back and try something else.
> As much as I like the idea of changing the swing of the door, it does create a small hazard of nailing someone who may be passing the door at the moment it opens. And one would have to close the door first, before stepping around it.



The other quick and easy is to just move the door closer to the laundry.


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## bud16415

nealtw said:


> The other quick and easy is to just move the door closer to the laundry.


:agree:
It is hard to see the layout of the powder room in your photos. Is the sink to the left of the toilet when walking in the room? If so moving that door and changing the swing the other direction (still an inswing) would go a long way to cleaning up the view and not breaking the bank.


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## zannej

bud16415 said:


> :agree:
> It is hard to see the layout of the powder room in your photos. Is the sink to the left of the toilet when walking in the room? If so moving that door and changing the swing the other direction (still an inswing) would go a long way to cleaning up the view and not breaking the bank.



I was thinking the same thing! If it won't hit anything, changing the door to swing inward the opposite direction might hide the toilet.

I also think you should try moving a piece of furniture in between for a short while and see how it works. It might prove to be annoying to get around it though, since the space is so small.

I absolutely despise the combo unit washer/dryers. Had to use one when I was living in a hotel while waiting for housing for several months when my family was overseas. I kept bumping my head on the dryer when I was reaching in to the top-load washer part.

The stacked ones aren't so bad from what I've seen (although I prefer non-stacked ones on pedestals bc I have a bad back). If you stack your washer and dryer on top of one another (or get something like the Electrolux IQ touch or one of the LG or Samsung models) you could put them where the dryer currently is (that's the one on the right?) That way the pathway to the door would be more direct and it would be less cramped when accessing it. You could then add different types of storage on the sides. You could even store things under the utility sink if there is enough room. houzz and pinterest of full of ideas on laundry room space-saving. I like the retractable drying rack that mounts on the wall. A friend of mine had that-- no picture since I can't fit many pics in one post.

There are some that apparently have a pull-out folding shelf and if the top stacked one is hard to reach, there is a carrying bin that can be flipped over and used as a stool (Safe T Stool from HD).

If you merge the laundry room and bathroom, maybe you could just put doors or something in front of the washer and dryer (if you wanted to go that route).
Save​


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## DenisTheThief

bud16415 said:


> :agree:
> It is hard to see the layout of the powder room in your photos. Is the sink to the left of the toilet when walking in the room? If so moving that door and changing the swing the other direction (still an inswing) would go a long way to cleaning up the view and not breaking the bank.



Thanks for the idea. Changing the swing, I like the cost. But I think visitors would still feel uncomfortable and it is still a turn-off for potential buyers. Same with moving the door, there's only a foot to work with.

Here's the latest... I went to Home Hardware to ask them. They thought having a full on the main floor is good since we have only one upstairs so it's closer than going to the basement. And we don't have enough space to put a bedroom down there anyway.

One idea I had is to do the switch but take a notch from the larger room for the laundry room, so it wouldn't be so small. I measured and it looks doable. And we could fit our current appliances in there. Here is the a visual. And also they sell these Utile Maax Shower Kits. They look nice. Not as nice as ceramic, but could save a lot: https://st.hzcdn.com/fimgs/70a1fd930631057b_2685-w500-h400-b0-p0--transitional-bathroom.jpg


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## bud16415

Looks like a plan that will work. 

I helped my nephew design his house and he was wondering what to do about a location for his laundry room. I suggested he forget about building a separate room to house the washer and dryer combine the too spaces into one much larger area and have the laundry along one wall of the large bathroom. We laid it out that way with some kitchen type cabinets above the two machines so there isn&#8217;t a lot of clutter and some hamper places. I think it works out nice and he and his wife love the less cramped feel in both rooms. It also solves the problem of a messy laundry room as you keep it picked up as it is a room you wont be hiding things in. 

Hallways are wasted space and if you moved the wall so the one room would enclose it all you would have a room 100 x 116 to work with

Just an idea.


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## DenisTheThief

bud16415 said:


> ...
> 
> Hallways are wasted space and if you moved the wall so the one room would enclose it all you would have a room 100 x 116 to work with
> 
> Just an idea.



I never thought of that...


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## zannej

Looks like a good plan, Denis.
If you are going to have enough room to have the washer and dryer side by side, you might want to build a pedestal under them (or have one built). I saw quite a few plans for them. 
This is a rough one that has a pull-out shelf to set the laundry baskets on when taking stuff out or putting stuff in the machines.
http://www.ana-white.com/2016/11/DIY_furniture/washer-dryer-pedestal






I saw another version in picture only that had two slides...





or someone went super fancy:





When relocating the dryer, did you think about the path for the dryer's vent? 
It seems like it vents out the side of the house for now, but if you move the appliances, you will need to find a new path for the vent that will go outside of the house. It should be somewhere that you will be able to access to clean out any lint that might get stuck in it.

When shopping for stuff, you might want to try a Habitat for Humanity ReStore if there is one in your area because they usually have lower prices or try something like Surplus Warehouse (again, if they have one near you). The one near me sells Maax shower units.


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## mabloodhound

I like your contractors suggestion except I'd probably use one of those pre-fab shower surrounds.
I also see hallways as a wasted space but if you remove those walls and put the door out at the end of the old hall, then you're back into the same visibility problem.
You're last floor plan looks like the best solution and you might even consider having just the one door into the bathroom and removing that wall entirely between the bath and laundry.  That way there is no extra door in the hall and might give you a bit more feeling of roominess in the bathroom and a larger shower.  Any shelving could go above the washer/dryer.


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## DenisTheThief

Well... we're almost done. It was a difficult choice. But we decided to convert the laundry room into a full bathroom. Thanks for everyone's feedback but of course we couldn't take everyone's advice. No right or wrong answers here.

The cost was about $7,000. But we've gone from 1.5 bathrooms to 2. When selling the house hopefully we'll get that money spent back. And we decided to put the washer/drier in the basement. Which was good since we didn't have to buy new appliances. The old powder-room will probably be a small storage room.

And 2 ideas given on this thread, to connect the fan with the light switch and putting something under the door, we still may do. The toilet is not so close to the dining area now but it isn't that far either. (may need to do some sound tests)


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## oldognewtrick

Thanks for giving us an update Dennis!


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## slownsteady

It's cool when a well-thought-out plan comes together. I'd like to see some more pics. Enjoy!


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## DenisTheThief

slownsteady said:


> It's cool when a well-thought-out plan comes together. I'd like to see some more pics. Enjoy!



OK Sure...

Granite vanity counter. First-time granite for us!


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## DenisTheThief

View of old Power Room from my seat at the diner table.

Rest easy... From now on, the only business that will take place in this room will be related to storage!


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## DenisTheThief

Here you go guest... You'll be comfortable now, with the knowledge that no one at the diner table will hear you.


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## zannej

It looks very nice!


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