# Help Please - Leaking Bathroom Faucet



## m4p

Hi all,
I have a 2 handle faucet in my bathroom that is leaking from the hot water side.  The handles are not attached to the faucet but actually in the counter.  The problem when I shut off the hot water, the handle stops at my mirror, but needs to go a little further to actually shut off the water completely.

I had the same problem with the cold side but was able to fix it by taking out the set screw, playing around with the handle and putting the set screw back in.  I tried it with the hot water side, but no luck.  

I can't figure out how to remove the cartridge.  The caps on the top of the handles look to be decorative only.

Any help would be greatly appreciated.  I am going to try to post some pictures.  I apologize but they seem to be coming out sideways.


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## slownsteady

It sounds like you should be able to lift the handle off and reposition it properly. I don't think it's necessary to remove the cartridge. However, if you do need to remove the cartridge, make sure you have turned off the water supply first. There is a cartridge removal tool available for purchase at Home Depot, Lowes etc., but I have been successful without it. 
After removing the handle, unscrew the escutcheon and then replace the handle. You can then lift the cartridge out using the handle. I have done this on a Moen faucet, but I can't say for sure whether it will work on other brands / models.


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## m4p

Thank you very much for the reply, Slownsteady.  The handles actually just unscrew off from the stem.  The problem is that the hole it screws into is facing too far back when I shut off the water, so the handle really needs to be able to go back another 1/2 inch or so, but the mirror is in the way.  

I'm going to try what you said to see if I can get the cartridge out, as I think the cartridge is probably shot.  The faucet is at least 16 years old.  Without the handle being on, I can shut off the water, but I have to turn it hard.


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## slownsteady

Does the handle slip when you turn it? 
If you unscrew the handle, and then turn the stem of the cartridge to "off" (no water flowing), you should be able to put the handle back on in the desired position.


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## joecaption

The screw to remove the handle is under that cap.
Most just pop off, even a butter knife may work to pop it off.
I use a small flat bladed screw driver.


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## beachguy005

It looks like the handle threads into the body and the body is held onto the stem with a small allen head set screw.  Loosen that, lift off and reposition the body and re-tighten the set screw. 
Oops...never mind.  Reread you post.


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## slownsteady

Do you know the brand of faucet?, that might be helpful.


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## nealtw

[ame]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U91jB3ij9UA[/ame]


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## m4p

slownsteady said:


> Does the handle slip when you turn it?
> If you unscrew the handle, and then turn the stem of the cartridge to "off" (no water flowing), you should be able to put the handle back on in the desired position.



Thanks, that's what I tried.  I was successful with the cold water side, but for some reason I just can't get it right on the hot side.  If I open up the hot water all the way, and then shut it off in a quick manner, it won't drip.  But if I don't open the water all the way and shut it off, it does drip.  

I'm going to have to try again but I need a better allen wrench.  The one I have is attached to a holder thing with other allen wrenches and it keeps folding into the holder.


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## m4p

joecaption said:


> The screw to remove the handle is under that cap.
> Most just pop off, even a butter knife may work to pop it off.
> I use a small flat bladed screw driver.



The top of the handle is really odd.  It has what looks to be a cap, but I think it might just be decorative.  I felt it with my fingernail and between the cap and the top of the handle is completely smooth.


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## m4p

slownsteady said:


> Do you know the brand of faucet?, that might be helpful.



I wish I did.  I can't find any indication of what brand it is.  At least when I fixed the dripping shower, the handle said Delta right on it.  This faucet has nothing written anywhere that I see.


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## m4p

nealtw said:


> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U91jB3ij9UA



Thanks for the video, Neal.  Videos are always helpful.  Now if I could just figure out how to get to the cartridges on my faucet.


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## slownsteady

Just yesterday I installed a new faucet. There were no screws at the top. Instead, the decorative handle cover screwed down on the valve body.
Another thing you could look for is whether the valve is slightly loose and spinning just a bit as you close the tap. You can check that by looking underneath as you or somebody else moves the handle. If so, you can tighten the nut underneath.


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## m4p

slownsteady said:


> Just yesterday I installed a new faucet. There were no screws at the top. Instead, the decorative handle cover screwed down on the valve body.
> Another thing you could look for is whether the valve is slightly loose and spinning just a bit as you close the tap. You can check that by looking underneath as you or somebody else moves the handle. If so, you can tighten the nut underneath.



Thank you.  I looked very carefuly again at the top.  If they are indeed caps, they are snug as a bug in a rug   Seriously, I'm afraid if I tried to remove the caps, I would scratch everything up.  I still think they're decorative.

I really like your idea to see if the valve is loose and will definitely check it out tomorrow.  

Also, I was having a hard time with the allen wrench I have (getting a new one tomorrow) and so the set screw is not completely in and tight.  I just hope I didn't strip it.  I'm assuming I could just take the set screw to a hardware store and get a new one?

Thanks again for your help.  I really appreciate it.


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## nealtw

The caps do come off
http://www.homedepot.com/b/Plumbing...-Parts-Repair-Caps-Index-Buttons/N-5yc1vZc6ae

You might have a metric set screw, taking it with you is a good idea.


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## frodo

.......................


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## slownsteady

Just to be clear; there may be no caps at the top of the faucet. Very recently I bought and installed a bathroom faucet that had no exposed screws. I don't know how long this design has been in use and I don't know if it is only a Moen feature. But the handle is integrated into the valve cover and it screws onto the exposed part of the valve. here are some pics to help explain:


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## m4p

Thanks, guys, I really appreciate all your help.  I think Frodo's diagram of my handles is right and that the caps are removable (the caps are just so small they looked like just a decoration).  Thanks for the pics, Slownsteady.  I wish mine was like yours, it looks like it might be easier.

I'm sure the caps have never been removed before so I hope it won't be too difficult to remove.  If a knife doesn't work, I was thinking of using a tiny flathead screwdriver, maybe putting masking tape over the end so as not to scratch up the cap.  

I did get another allen wrench size 3/32.  I'm at work today but plan on continuing this fun project tomorrow.  Thanks again!


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## nealtw

http://www.stanleytools.com/explore/project-guides/how-to-repair-a-leaky-bathroom-faucet


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## m4p

I"m ready to pull my hair out.  I got the wrong size allen wrench. I need a 5/64, not a 3/32.  I also tried to remove the caps.  No luck whatsoever.  I also went under the sink while someone else jiggled the handle.  Things below are tight.  Argh!!!  Oh well, I'll give it another shot tomorrow.  Thanks again, guys.


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## m4p

UPDATE:  Woo hoo!  I finally got it apart, well most of the way anyway.  Those caps were just decorative.  I just removed the set screw and kept moving the stem up and down until it came off (there are actually 2 set screws on each handle).  The leak is a little worse now.  When I shut off the water, it drips, drips, drips constantly.

I just don't know what to do next.  I know unscrew the top screw but what happens after that I have no idea.  I hope this is a cartridge where I can just remove it and get the part.  I hope it's not where I'd have to replace o-rings or springs because I would really be lost.  I"ve been watching the video that Nealnw posted.  Now I know to use a razor blade to get rid of the schmootz (love that word).

Here's a pic (sorry, looks like it's upside down.  It was right side up on my computer):


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## slownsteady

Mazel tov! (goes with schmootz). Now where exactly is it leaking from? The spout? the base of the faucet? Underneath the sink? Be as specific as possible.


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## jeffmattero76

I only use Moen single handle faucets so I am not familiar with the type you are working on. However, I would start by removing the large nut just below the stem. Once you do that take a picture and post it, or look for some type of hardware that is holding the cartridge inside the body of the faucet. With Moens, the retainer is a U shaped piece that slips through a slot in the valve body. Once you remove that retainer the cartridge can be pulled out. Sometimes you need a puller tool, but most times channel lock pliers will do the trick. If you can find the name of the company that made the faucet, call them, since many faucets come with lifetime warrantys. Often they will send you the cartridges and associated parts for free, rather than paying $30 or so at a big box or supply house.

Obviously, all of this should be done with the water off below the sink.


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## havasu

Yep, most likely Moen will send you a replacement cartridge for free.


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## m4p

Hi guys,

Thanks so much for the replies.  I appreciate them more than you can know.  Sorry for the delay but we got hit with 10" of snow over the weekend so my project got delayed.  I still can't figure out what brand this faucet is, but here's a pic of it taken apart.  The leak is from the spout only, on the hot side, although I am going to buy replacement parts for the cold side while I'm at it in case I need them in the future.  

I've been watching videos and reading articles but I'm still not sure how to remove the cartridge.  Do I unscrew the screw that is on the top?  Do I remove that retaining clip?  I'm lost as to what I should be doing next (and confused why my pictures keep coming out sideways).


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## nealtw

*I think* I would pull the wire keeper and undo the chrome nut.


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## m4p

nealtw said:


> *I think* I would pull the wire keeper and undo the chrome nut.



Thanks!  So I don't do anything with the screw on top?


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## havasu

I believe the screw on top is only there if you needed to replace the various handle configurations. As Neal recommended, pull the clip and unscrew the chrome piece. Then either match up and replace the entire stem or purchase the parts to make it "whole" again. Since it may help others down the road, please take a pic of the stem for us once you remove it.


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## m4p

havasu said:


> I believe the screw on top is only there if you needed to replace the various handle configurations. As Neal recommended, pull the clip and unscrew the chrome piece. Then either match up and replace the entire stem or purchase the parts to make it "whole" again. Since it may help others down the road, please take a pic of the stem for us once you remove it.



Thank you, I will definitely take a pic once I get it removed.  I think the less parts I have to deal with, so much the better, so hopefully I can just get a replacement stem.  I know when I fixed my leaky shower, it was just a big cartridge piece that I replaced.  That one was a lot easier because it was a Delta and they had a video on their website that showed exactly what to do.  Plus, they sent the part for free.  I can't find any indication of the brand of this faucet.  There are some numbers on the aerator, but I think it may just be for the aerator itself.


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## nealtw

m4p said:


> Thanks!  So I don't do anything with the screw on top?



look for a name on the spot some times in the front sometimes on the back


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## m4p

nealtw said:


> look for a name on the spot some times in the front sometimes on the back



I know it had some numbers and then 2.5 gpm or something like that.  I'm going to check again when I get home from work.  Thanks!


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## m4p

Finally got the cartridge out.  Unfortunately I couldn't get the water to shut off completely, so water is coming up out of the brass base part.  Can't wait to get home from work and see the mess.  Hopefully not that much more water will leak out.  I left rags all around it.

Here's some pics of the cartridge, and the leaky base.  Do you guys think I'll be able to find this part at a Home Depot, or would I have to go to a plumbing supply store?

Thanks for hanging in there with me on this fun project.


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## nealtw

HD should have them, hot and cold are different.


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## m4p

nealtw said:


> HD should have them, hot and cold are different.



Thanks, Neal.  I went on HD's site and looked at about 120 cartridges and didn't find a good enough match (although they probably have some that are in the store and not online).  So there's a plumbing supply about 20 minutes from work that I'm gonna go to and leave work early as they close at 5.  The guy on the phone there seemed really knowledgeable and I think I'd feel better than relying on HD not having the correct part and also answering my questions.  

My concern is the bubbling up of the water in the part that I pulled the cartridge out of.  However, before I left for work, I turned off the cold water too.  Evidently because I have a widespread faucet and it makes a T underneath, the cold water, if not shut off, can come up through the hot water side where I took the cartridge out (at least that's what the plumbing supply guy said).  So hopefully I won't have a mess when I get home.

We're due for another snow storm tonight so that's why I'm anxious to get the part today.  Wish me luck!  and thanks again for all your help too!


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## m4p

Update:  So I went to the plumbing supply and got both the hot and cold side ceramic cartridges.  Came home to a lake on the counter.  Turned off the whole house water shutoff and proceeded to install the new hot side cartridge.

I'm embarrassed to say the darn thing is still leaking, although not nearly as bad, and at least the handle is now in the right position.  Does anyone have an idea why replacing the cartridge wouldn't stop the leak completely?  I'm wondering if, because it's a widespread faucet and has that T thing underneath the sink, if the cold side is bad too, even though it doesn't seem to be leaking.  

I also found this and wonder if I should try it:  "Moen also recommended cleaning out the inside of the valve with an old toothbrush or bottle brush and then flushing thoroughly before installing the new cartridge."

I know when I pulled out the old cartridge on the hot side, it was in very bad shape.

Wish I would have hired a plumber


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## nealtw

m4p said:


> Update:  So I went to the plumbing supply and got both the hot and cold side ceramic cartridges.  Came home to a lake on the counter.  Turned off the whole house water shutoff and proceeded to install the new hot side cartridge.
> 
> I'm embarrassed to say the darn thing is still leaking, although not nearly as bad, and at least the handle is now in the right position.  Does anyone have an idea why replacing the cartridge wouldn't stop the leak completely?  I'm wondering if, because it's a widespread faucet and has that T thing underneath the sink, if the cold side is bad too, even though it doesn't seem to be leaking.
> 
> I also found this and wonder if I should try it:  "Moen also recommended cleaning out the inside of the valve with an old toothbrush or bottle brush and then flushing thoroughly before installing the new cartridge."
> 
> I know when I pulled out the old cartridge on the hot side, it was in very bad shape.
> 
> Wish I would have hired a plumber



Did you remove the old washer. It only takes a little chunk of junk in the ceramic to hold it open.


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## m4p

nealtw said:


> Did you remove the old washer. It only takes a little chunk of junk in the ceramic to hold it open.



I did remove it.  However, it came out in pieces, and even after removing it, it still had a white ring where the white washer was.  That would be awesome if that's all it is.  I think I will take it apart and use an old toothbrush to scrub the area.  Wonder if something like CLR would be good to use?  Thanks, Neal!


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## nealtw

m4p said:


> I did remove it.  However, it came out in pieces, and even after removing it, it still had a white ring where the white washer was.  That would be awesome if that's all it is.  I think I will take it apart and use an old toothbrush to scrub the area.  Wonder if something like CLR would be good to use?  Thanks, Neal!



Instect the new valve and make sure there is nothing in it block it. 
Once you have cleaned out the unit. put a cup or glass over it and a rag over that and give it a little shot of water to blow any crude out.


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## nealtw

[ame]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HpYfBCvK4Bg[/ame]


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## slownsteady

If, like you mentioned, a washer came out in pieces it must be replaced. Also, if I'm reading this correctly the water is leaking from around the base of the cartridge. If the cartridge was bad, the water would be dripping from the spout when it should be off.

I'm curious how much the two cartridges cost, plus whatever you still need to repair this faucet vs. the cost of a new faucet. I know the installation of a new faucet is pretty straightforward and relatively easy.


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## nealtw

slownsteady said:


> If, like you mentioned, a washer came out in pieces it must be replaced. Also, if I'm reading this correctly the water is leaking from around the base of the cartridge. If the cartridge was bad, the water would be dripping from the spout when it should be off.
> 
> I'm curious how much the two cartridges cost, plus whatever you still need to repair this faucet vs. the cost of a new faucet. I know the installation of a new faucet is pretty straightforward and relatively easy.


It's not like a normal washer, it is that blue ring on the bottom of the new one.


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## m4p

slownsteady said:


> If, like you mentioned, a washer came out in pieces it must be replaced. Also, if I'm reading this correctly the water is leaking from around the base of the cartridge. If the cartridge was bad, the water would be dripping from the spout when it should be off.
> 
> I'm curious how much the two cartridges cost, plus whatever you still need to repair this faucet vs. the cost of a new faucet. I know the installation of a new faucet is pretty straightforward and relatively easy.



No, it was leaking from the spout.  I ended up removing the hot water cartridge that I had just installed.  Then I cleaned up a ton of gunk that was in the ring of the brass where I'm assuming the o-ring of the cartridge would sit.

Now I'm trying to replace the cold side cartridge.  However, the valve body (?) keeps turning when I try to remove the cartridge.  I tried some liquid wrench but no luck.  Of course I managed to twist the faucet's cold side water hose all up.  I disconnected the hose and put it back on correctly.  But the cartridge is still stuck.  I'm hoping when my husband gets home from work, he can hold the valve body (maybe from below) and then I can try to unscrew the cartridge.  

This project is turning out an abysmal failure.  The cartridges cost $50.  I think that plus all the time and frustration would have been better spent on a plumber.  That's what I get for being hard headed 

(picture not mine but shows the problem)


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## slownsteady

On the other hand, you've learned a lot and will be better prepared for the next time.:thbup:


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## m4p

slownsteady said:


> On the other hand, you've learned a lot and will be better prepared for the next time.:thbup:



Sadly, I don't think there's going to be another time.  My husband was able to get the cartridge out.  So I put the new one in and I'm all happy.  Then I turned the water back on....

There is barely any water pressure from either the hot or the cold.  So I looked underneath the sink, and it appears it's leaking from the T thing that the hoses hook into.

And of course my husband is now doing the I told you so thing, saying I should have listened to him and got a plumber in the first place (says the man who is not handy.  He tried to fix the clothes washer one time and backed up into a pipe and broke the pipe).

Anyway, thanks so much for sticking with me through this ordeal


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## nealtw

m4p said:


> Sadly, I don't think there's going to be another time.  My husband was able to get the cartridge out.  So I put the new one in and I'm all happy.  Then I turned the water back on....
> 
> There is barely any water pressure from either the hot or the cold.  So I looked underneath the sink, and it appears it's leaking from the T thing that the hoses hook into.
> 
> And of course my husband is now doing the I told you so thing, saying I should have listened to him and got a plumber in the first place (says the man who is not handy.  He tried to fix the clothes washer one time and backed up into a pipe and broke the pipe).
> 
> Anyway, thanks so much for sticking with me through this ordeal



In the video in post 39 , he talks about taking it out and going to the store and having them remove it because they are installed to tight. starts about 200 in the video.


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## m4p

nealtw said:


> In the video in post 39 , he talks about taking it out and going to the store and having them remove it because they are installed to tight. starts about 200 in the video.



Thanks, Neal.  I did see that part (after I'd already twisted the supply line, like he said might happen.  We were able to remove the cartridge.  First I undid the supply line and let it hang temporarily.  Then my husband was able to hold the valve and turn the cartridge to remove it.  That part went fine.  

However, when we were all done, the water pressure from both hot and cold were very low, and there was dripping under the sink, which seemed to be coming from the hot water supply line.  We undid the supply line and reconnected it.  Still leaking.

Coincidently, my brother in law is fixing up a house that's one street over from us, and of all things, his plumber is scheduled to go do some work there today.  So the plumber is going to come to our house when he's done.  We've had this same plumber do other work for us in the past (like when my husband broke a pipe) and he's great.

Makes me wonder how many jobs plumbers get from homeowners messing up


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## slownsteady

I'd like to hear whatever the plumber has to say. Ask plenty of questions! (and let us know!  )


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## nealtw

slownsteady said:


> I'd like to hear whatever the plumber has to say. Ask plenty of questions! (and let us know!  )



I don't see the advantage over the old washer and seat valve, they could have made it with ball valves.


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## slownsteady

that's because you're a carpenter


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## m4p

Well guys, it's finally done, finished, finito!  Plumber showed up a few minutes after noon and left at around one.  

He said it was a shame, because I was so close, but it wasn't anything I did (I asked him if it was my fault it was leaking under the sink).

He replaced the water lines, had to adjust the valve seat or whatever that brass thing is that the cartridge goes into.  Evidently when I was having my husband tighten it, it raised it up.  It also did all kinds of other adjustments (at that point, I didn't want to seem like I was breathing down his neck, but I did ask him lots of questions).  

Then he caulked around the sink, and that was that.

A big part, or maybe the whole reason, for the low water pressure was the horribly clogged up aerator.  My husband had tried to get it off, but didn't want to totally ruin in.  So the plumber was able to get it off, and cleaned out the aerator and pressure was normal again.

Lesson learned I guess.  Next time get a new faucet and hire a plumber to install it 

Oh, by the way, did I tell you I have a drip from my kitchen faucet.......:rofl:

I want to thank all of you for all the help, insight and support throughout this fun project.


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## nealtw

m4p said:


> Well guys, it's finally done, finished, finito!  Plumber showed up a few minutes after noon and left at around one.
> 
> He said it was a shame, because I was so close, but it wasn't anything I did (I asked him if it was my fault it was leaking under the sink).
> 
> He replaced the water lines, had to adjust the valve seat or whatever that brass thing is that the cartridge goes into.  Evidently when I was having my husband tighten it, it raised it up.  It also did all kinds of other adjustments (at that point, I didn't want to seem like I was breathing down his neck, but I did ask him lots of questions).
> 
> Then he caulked around the sink, and that was that.
> 
> A big part, or maybe the whole reason, for the low water pressure was the horribly clogged up aerator.  My husband had tried to get it off, but didn't want to totally ruin in.  So the plumber was able to get it off, and cleaned out the aerator and pressure was normal again.
> 
> Lesson learned I guess.  Next time get a new faucet and hire a plumber to install it
> 
> Oh, by the way, did I tell you I have a drip from my kitchen faucet.......:rofl:
> 
> I want to thank all of you for all the help, insight and support throughout this fun project.



I am glad you think it was fun. I think we all learned a little too.
In the kitchen, don't force anything just get a bigger hammer.:trophy:


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