# Wood to use when framing windows in foundation?



## 1victorianfarmhouse (Oct 18, 2016)

I have an old (1895) house where the basement windows are the hinged fold in type surrounded by simple wood that is in contact with the brick/limestone/cement foundation.  Building replacements is easy, but I am curious as to what kind of treated wood I should use to build the frames with since it will be in contact with stone and eventually painted?

Thanks!

Vince


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## nealtw (Oct 18, 2016)

Regular treated wood, but I would want to dry it first, oil base prime all 6 sides before assembly, sheet poly or sill gasket between wood and concrete and galvanized fastners


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## 1victorianfarmhouse (Oct 18, 2016)

Thanks Neal!  That is why I ask, you guys tell me a lot more than I was thinking and it makes perfect sense.  I am now thinking of using a gasket that has some thickness to it (1/32-1/16" inch) and running it as a continuous band around the frame with the ends at the top.  Trimmed to fit after installation.  Does this make sense?

Thanks again,

Vince


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## nealtw (Oct 18, 2016)

1victorianfarmhouse said:


> Thanks Neal!  That is why I ask, you guys tell me a lot more than I was thinking and it makes perfect sense.  I am now thinking of using a gasket that has some thickness to it (1/32-1/16" inch) and running it as a continuous band around the frame with the ends at the top.  Trimmed to fit after installation.  Does this make sense?
> 
> Thanks again,
> 
> Vince



Sill gasket is a foam that we put between wood and concrete but sheet poly is good, You just want to stop the  wicking or moisture.

We put the treated lumber in concrete forms for windows and leave, but we leave room for framing inside that to a smaller window and everything gets hidden behind siding  and interior finish. You likely don't have that room so you have to make do, I you can you would like to do a rainscreen installation but making everything look good in an old house?? You are likely trying to replicate was was there just better.
[ame]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t2VOrk1MuWY[/ame]


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## 1victorianfarmhouse (Oct 18, 2016)

Hi Neal,

Thanks again.  I think I've managed to upload a photo of one of the existing windows, which is missing the storm window.  The window you see is hinged and folds inwards when the latch is released.   You are correct in thinking that I want to replicate what is already there but in poor shape but with better/modern materials.  Menard's sells a 4 pane garage window that only requires minor trimming to fit where the original storms went.  

Vince


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## nealtw (Oct 19, 2016)

Yeah, if you are just replacing what you have, try to build is so you have some slope on the bottom.


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## KULTULZ (Oct 19, 2016)

nealtw said:


> Regular treated wood, but I would want to dry it first, oil base prime all 6 sides before assembly, sheet poly or sill gasket between wood and concrete and galvanized fastners





You know something? 

It is a rarity that when I come here that I don't learn something (I am in no way a professional).

How long would you want that wood to sit and dry before sealing?


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## nealtw (Oct 19, 2016)

Treated wood is usually freshly treated and heavy with water or treatment. They will shrink considerably and some will warp and twist.
Drying it will allow for sorting out the junk and give paint a better chance at sticking as well giving the fit a chance to be constant.

A wet 2x4 might be 1 5/8" thick and a dry one will be 1 1/2" thick and a whole lot lighter.
If it is piled with sticks between them in a garage for a month or so, you will have a much better job.

Most time wet lumber is easier to deal with like for wall plates and such but for something technical like a window frame, you need quality and straightness and something that will take paint. But in the concrete like this you still want treatment.


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## oldognewtrick (Oct 19, 2016)

Could Vince use a PVC type material on the frame?


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## bud16415 (Oct 19, 2016)

Vince

Great thread, and the photo of your window I think I&#8217;m looking at my own windows. 

I have plans for next spring reworking a bunch of mine also so I will be following along. 

I like the peal and stick gasket tape stuff that comes about 6&#8221; wide. As to the PT wood the PT doesn&#8217;t prevent the wood from taking on water. I always buy mine from a building center that stores it indoors. You will notice the difference as soon as you pick a piece up. Most of the lumber yards around here keep it outside some don&#8217;t even cover it.


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## bud16415 (Oct 19, 2016)

oldognewtrick said:


> Could Vince use a PVC type material on the frame?



I was thinking the same thing until I priced it out. I would say if I was 20 years old and planning on living there forever I might spring for PVC, but then again when I was 20 I wouldnt have been able to afford it and used untreated most likely. PT will last 40 years and with paint and such much longer. Vinces pine frames made it 120 years and I have to say his look better than mine. Im feeling like I should try and do mine this fall now as I think it is how the mouse gets in.


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## Mastercarpenty (Oct 19, 2016)

Here in the south, the usual treated wood is yellow pine- a poor species for finish wood to begin with and no better once treated. Lumberyards can order better wood species (expensive) or you can order a "premium" treated pine which starts as a better grade of wood and has been air-dried and culled already. It costs somewhat more but I like it for decking boards especially because it does not shrink and split like normal treated wood does. 

With the usual treated wood I prefer to let it dry in place around 45-60 days before priming and painting. The last 5 days or so it should not see any rain. If the wood is too wet when you paint it often peels and I hate doing a job twice when once is enough.

Phil


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## nealtw (Oct 19, 2016)

1victorianfarmhouse said:


> Hi Neal,
> 
> Thanks again.  I think I've managed to upload a photo of one of the existing windows, which is missing the storm window.  The window you see is hinged and folds inwards when the latch is released.   You are correct in thinking that I want to replicate what is already there but in poor shape but with better/modern materials.  Menard's sells a 4 pane garage window that only requires minor trimming to fit where the original storms went.
> 
> Vince



I would like to see a window well there too with 6" to 8" of exposed foundation below the window. A simple frame of 4x6 underground rated treated
Dig out a level platform 2 ft by 4 ft lay down some real heavy landscape fabric
lay in the frame. back fill around outside and put about 1" of gravel on top of fabric.

The normal argument against the well is, "it will fill with water"
And if that is true then you do need the well and the drainage you need anyway


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## 1victorianfarmhouse (Oct 19, 2016)

Wow, I'm surprised at all the comments!  Not surprised at the good info, that's expected with this board.

Neal, you are correct about there being a bit of a slope for the bottom panel.  It's really hard to tell how much with the old paint and wood getting in the way.  Once I take one out in the spring, I'll be better able to measure the slope. I have attached a picture that sort of shows the slope.  The wooden strips on the side that hold the windows in place are missing from the bottom.  The section in front is where the storm window (or screen) would go. 

There are basically two types of windows in the basement, singles an doubles.  I've attached a picture of the outer and inner of a double (pardon the hostas for getting in the way.


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## nealtw (Oct 19, 2016)

The original wood would have been the good stuff you find inside the older lumberyards dry straight and sharp corners all top grade for what ever species it is and they would have been framed just like a door frame with 5* slope on the bottom. I had friends that worked for a very old window and door outfit that did everything the old way and they bought the very best timbers, dried and and cut and dressed everything themselves. Hard to match that quality.


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## KULTULZ (Oct 19, 2016)

What about composite decking material? 

Go or no-go?


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## Blue Jay (Oct 19, 2016)

Another thought, how about using cedar?


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## 1victorianfarmhouse (Oct 20, 2016)

The idea of using composite decking material is interesting.  I asked about wood simply because I can get it easily, and can cut it easily.  Plus, it's what has been there for 120+ years and I'm familiar with it.

Vince


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## oldognewtrick (Oct 20, 2016)

1victorianfarmhouse said:


> The idea of using composite decking material is interesting.  I asked about wood simply because I can get it easily, and can cut it easily.  Plus, it's what has* been there for 120+ years* and I'm familiar with it.
> 
> Vince



Neal might have put those windows in...:canadaflag:


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## nealtw (Oct 20, 2016)

Have you thought about stripping the paint you wood looks good from what we can see.
My hostas have already died off for the winter.


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## nealtw (Oct 20, 2016)

oldognewtrick said:


> Neal might have put those windows in...:canadaflag:



No, I was busy building my time machine:rofl:


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