# From Rigid PVC to Hose



## Archena (May 13, 2014)

I'm designing a pet cage that has a drain. Initially, I need to use hose for the drainage (the drain itself and the pipe from it to the exterior will be rigid PVC - I don't have to disassemble them when I move), but I'm not sure about the best way to attach it. The little nozzles the home improvement store has look like a clog waiting to happen (because little bowels aren't always regular). 

Any ideas?


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## bud16415 (May 13, 2014)

Try mounting a toilet flange from the bottom.


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## slownsteady (May 13, 2014)

The pipe diameter should be a consideration, and the bends that it has to make. 
To be clear; are you going from rigid PVC at the cage to hose somewhere in the run?


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## Wuzzat? (May 13, 2014)

Archena said:


> look like a clog waiting to happen
> Any ideas?


If you're going from large ID pipe to small ID pipe then maybe a small effluent or sludge or sewage pump will help.  Depending on the consistency, a pond pump may even work.  
There's no penalty except financial for oversizing the pump.

Sensing when the pump needs to turn on is a little more complicated so you may want to run it on a timer.

Work it all out on paper before you spend a dime.  I've heard this forum will do a
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Design_review


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## Archena (May 13, 2014)

bud16415 said:


> Try mounting a toilet flange from the bottom.


I found a sink flange that will work - each unit will have its own drain.


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## Archena (May 13, 2014)

slownsteady said:


> The pipe diameter should be a consideration, and the bends that it has to make.
> To be clear; are you going from rigid PVC at the cage to hose somewhere in the run?



Pipe will be 1 1/4 inch. 

Yes, the drain, flange and initial run will be rigid PVC and the remaining run will be hose (for now - once I have a permanent place I'll probably shift over to an all rigid drain).

Here's the basic idea (showing the cage bottom, flange and initial run along with the unconnected hose):


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## Archena (May 13, 2014)

Wuzzat? said:


> If you're going from large ID pipe to small ID pipe then maybe a small effluent or sludge or sewage pump will help.  Depending on the consistency, a pond pump may even work.
> There's no penalty except financial for oversizing the pump.
> 
> Sensing when the pump needs to turn on is a little more complicated so you may want to run it on a timer.
> ...



I wasn't planning on going from a large to small pipe - the problem is the nozzle connectors make a much smaller opening than either the pipe or the hose so I was hoping to come up with a better connection.

But I will keep this in mind - thanks!


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## Wuzzat? (May 13, 2014)

With the right keywords you may succeed with an online patent search to see what general problems had to be overcome by people who had this idea before you.


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## slownsteady (May 14, 2014)

Are you building a kennel?


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## Archena (May 14, 2014)

slownsteady said:


> Are you building a kennel?



A cattery, actually.


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## slownsteady (May 14, 2014)

New word for me...but i could have guessed. As long as it's not a cat house, I suppose it's ok.

If you have a row of cages, you could run a main line underneath them all and tee in each cage.
Do you need to run the works into a septic or your homes waste line? If you have enough cages, i think you would need to.


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## Wuzzat? (May 14, 2014)

"In the United States, there are two main cat registries - the Cat Fanciers Association (CFA) and The International Cat Association (TICA) [1] which establish standards for member breeders. These cat registries also award certificates for catteries that have been inspected for healthy environments. Additionally, many U.S. States and municipalities, along with the Federal government, provide some regulations of breeding catteries."

I guess you need to know the weekly 'output' for each cat before you can size the plumbing.  The more cats you have, the more likely the total output will correspond to Web averages, if you can find such a thing.:hide:


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## Archena (May 15, 2014)

slownsteady said:


> New word for me...but i could have guessed. As long as it's not a cat house, I suppose it's ok.
> 
> If you have a row of cages, you could run a main line underneath them all and tee in each cage.
> Do you need to run the works into a septic or your homes waste line? If you have enough cages, i think you would need to.



Initially, we're doing this the old fashioned way - but it beats changing paper. When I move, I'll hire a real plumber to tie it in to the septic system - with a clean out for emergencies.


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## Archena (May 15, 2014)

Wuzzat? said:


> "In the United States, there are two main cat registries - the Cat Fanciers Association (CFA) and The International Cat Association (TICA) [1] which establish standards for member breeders. These cat registries also award certificates for catteries that have been inspected for healthy environments. Additionally, many U.S. States and municipalities, along with the Federal government, provide some regulations of breeding catteries."
> 
> I guess you need to know the weekly 'output' for each cat before you can size the plumbing.  The more cats you have, the more likely the total output will correspond to Web averages, if you can find such a thing.:hide:



Actually, an average sized, healthy, adult cat drinks about 6 to 8 oz a day and produces probably half of that in urine so the system should be oversized for the expected flow (a sick cat can produce quite a bit more and er, messier fluids, if you get my drift). I'm mostly concerned about the inevitable particulate clogging the nozzle connectors.


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## Wuzzat? (May 15, 2014)

Archena said:


> drinks about 6 to 8 oz a day and produces probably half of that in urine
> 
> I'm mostly concerned about the inevitable particulate clogging the nozzle connectors.


And the difference lost by respiration and transpiration.

A water pump on a 10 second timer a few times/day may solve clogging problems.  It's sort of an auto flush.  People need 100 gals per person per day so a cat who doesn't shower or do laundry may get by with much less.


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## blekenbleu (May 15, 2014)

Archena said:


> Pipe will be 1 1/4 inch.
> 
> Yes, the drain, flange and initial run will be rigid PVC and the remaining run will be hose (for now - once I have a permanent place I'll probably shift over to an all rigid drain).



I recently did something similar, using an old bicycle innertube for the
hose, stretched over the PVC..


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## nealtw (May 16, 2014)

So when this is done can we see a photo?


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## slownsteady (May 16, 2014)

Traditionally (and logically) waste pipes get bigger in diameter as they move away from the source. To avoid a bottleneck, why can't you go to a larger diameter hose?


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## Archena (May 16, 2014)

slownsteady said:


> Traditionally (and logically) waste pipes get bigger in diameter as they move away from the source. To avoid a bottleneck, why can't you go to a larger diameter hose?



Mostly because I can't find a connector that goes from smaller to bigger like that. 

The connection is the problem.


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## Archena (May 16, 2014)

nealtw said:


> So when this is done can we see a photo?



It'll be awhile - Mr Bank Account isn't on speaking terms with me right now - but yes, once I get it done I'll post a pic.


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## Archena (May 16, 2014)

blekenbleu said:


> I recently did something similar, using an old bicycle innertube for the
> hose, stretched over the PVC..



That sounds promising but would be awfully short.


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## slownsteady (May 16, 2014)

You may be limited by the places you shop for it. If you're stuck on garden hose, you may not look beyond the garden department at Lowes.

Here's just one idea: http://www.poolandspapartsdepot.com/waterway-1-1-2-buttress-x-1-1-2-or-1-1-4-hose-400-9280/

There is also the option to rethink the pipe run, and maybe eliminate the hose altogether.


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## blekenbleu (May 18, 2014)

nealtw said:


> So when this is done can we see a photo?



Who, me?  I have tried to attach an image here..


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## blekenbleu (May 18, 2014)

Archena said:


> That sounds promising but would be awfully short.



True enough, if flexibility of hose is needed for substantial length.
Otherwise, going between bike tube and PVC sections is easy..


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## nealtw (May 19, 2014)

Thanks, I was having trouble understanding what you guys were talking about.


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## Archena (May 21, 2014)

slownsteady said:


> You may be limited by the places you shop for it. If you're stuck on garden hose, you may not look beyond the garden department at Lowes.
> 
> Here's just one idea: http://www.poolandspapartsdepot.com/waterway-1-1-2-buttress-x-1-1-2-or-1-1-4-hose-400-9280/
> 
> There is also the option to rethink the pipe run, and maybe eliminate the hose altogether.



:

That will do it! Thanks!

The hose is temporary - the only way to eliminate it would be a pipe and that creates trouble on disassembly.


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## Archena (May 21, 2014)

blekenbleu said:


> True enough, if flexibility of hose is needed for substantial length.
> Otherwise, going between bike tube and PVC sections is easy..



I need the length for the upper tier - but I'll definitely keep this in mind!


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