# Vaulted Ceilings and Solar Panels



## costelme (Aug 3, 2014)

I am getting ready to settle on my house, small house a little out of the way. My parents have been toying with the idea of solar panels and I have looked at them for my house as well, mostly to save on energy costs as I have well water and will use extra power just for that.
The problem I have seen is that all my ceilings are vaulted, straight up to the roof. A nice touch aesthetically but a possible nightmare for solar panels from what I can tell.
First, how can I go about reinforcing the ceiling/roof for solar panels (inside beams? build an attic?)?
Second, about how much should I budget for this (ballpark is fine obviously no one can give me an exact)?
Third, can I live in the house while this reinforcement goes on? 

This is not something I plan on doing right away but I seriously want to make sure I get the most out of the property for the duration of my owning it and then be able to make a decent return. I don't want some shoddy job, I would love to increase is aesthetic charm while reinforcing the structure itself.
Thanks.


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## CallMeVilla (Aug 3, 2014)

Maybe things are different in NJ, but here in the land of solar power, nobody reinforces their roofs to install solar.  Have you consulted with solar companies about this?  I have seen full roof installations on all manner of roof lines with no restructuring required.

Start with solar company assessment of your roof before going crazy.


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## kok328 (Aug 3, 2014)

I used to work for a solar panel manufacturer and the saying was "_you'll be dead before you see a payback on your investment_".
20 years is the break even point on a solar installation.


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## costelme (Aug 3, 2014)

Yikes...okay then. Thanks for the advice. Probably not something I would ever hear from a solar company I was soliciting for quotes.


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## CallMeVilla (Aug 3, 2014)

Well, KOK, that was in the old days ... when you had to buy banks of batteries to store the power.  Modern solar systems benefit from state and federal rebates PLUS the power is fed back into the utility grid which "banks" the excess kW in credit to you!

No expensive batteries.  There are multiple plans available:

1.  Lease the equipment and let the power generated be credited.  The solar company retains the rebates.
2.  Buy the entire operation and you keep the rebates.  You also let the power credit or debit get handled through your electric meter.
3.  You buy NOTHING but contract with the solar company at a set rate per kW for 20 years which is decidedly under the rate now being charged by the local utility.  The company is responsible for upkeep and repairs.  They also keep the rebate (but you never spent a dime, so who cares).

Option #3 might be the best ...  Times have certainly changed, haven't they?


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## nealtw (Aug 4, 2014)

All roofs are not equal. If a roof is designed for a heavy snow load it will have much more structure in it and they limit how many layers of shingles because of the added weight so having the roof checked for the added weight would be a good idea.


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## havasu (Aug 4, 2014)

My son recently installed solar panels on his home. Since I have always been a neigh-sayer about wasting money on this, he has been documenting his bill for me. His Electric bill was averaging ~$350 a month, but his last three summer electric bills were all under $1.00. With the zero percent interest for the solar panels and installation, along with the tax rebates, he is actually saving ~150.00 a month.


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## kok328 (Aug 4, 2014)

havasu said:


> My son recently installed solar panels on his home. Since I have always been a neigh-sayer about wasting money on this, he has been documenting his bill for me. His Electric bill was averaging ~$350 a month, but his last three summer electric bills were all under $1.00. With the zero percent interest for the solar panels and installation, along with the tax rebates, he is actually saving ~150.00 a month.



How much was his initial outlay in $ ?

There's no denying that you will see an immediate reduction in cost of utilities but, how long will it take to get your total investment back?

As far as I know, energy credits for solar installations have expired thus, the demise of the company that I worked for.


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## havasu (Aug 4, 2014)

It is a 15 year loan, and after credits, cost him ~ $20K. 

I believe the difference is the fact that his house is over 4000 square feet, with a huge pool and Jacuzzi. My little house would never justify this expense, and with summer electric bills running less that ~$150 a month, would not be worth it.


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## havasu (Aug 4, 2014)

The biggest factor for my son was the fact that electric prices will never go down, and only up. He is banking on the fact that in 10 years, electric bills will probably run in excess of $500 a month, but for him, maybe ~$3.00? 

You also need to consider this house is in Southern California, where the average price per home is $3/4 million, and the installation of the solar panels will be a great perk for any new home buyers.


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## nealtw (Aug 4, 2014)

I don't think 20 years is a good arguement against panels. The real question is, will they need to be replaced and how often, cost of maintenance and cleaning.


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## CallMeVilla (Aug 4, 2014)

You DO NOT have to buy the system.  You can contract for a fixed price on the electricity rate and PAY ZERO on the equipment.  The company benefits from rebates and from excess electricity produced at the utility rate.  The company gets the difference while you get the fixed energy bill.

Nonetheless, the company is on the hook for repairs and maintenance.

In essence, you pay nothing down, get a frozen utility bill and never see an increase in rates.


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## nealtw (Aug 5, 2014)

CallMeVilla said:


> You DO NOT have to buy the system.  You can contract for a fixed price on the electricity rate and PAY ZERO on the equipment.  The company benefits from rebates and from excess electricity produced at the utility rate.  The company gets the difference while you get the fixed energy bill.
> 
> Nonetheless, the company is on the hook for repairs and maintenance.
> 
> In essence, you pay nothing down, get a frozen utility bill and never see an increase in rates.



Those kind of deals havn't made there way up here yet, what we need are water wheels on the downspouts.:beer:


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## bud16415 (Aug 5, 2014)

Around here the saying is &#8220;There is no such thing as a free lunch.&#8221; If free enterprise and market forces are left to do their job innovation is pushed ahead and there is progress in any technology. 

I don&#8217;t know where solar power is at but it&#8217;s being blindly pushed by this administration. Some percentage of the country has enough clear sunny days to make this somewhat practical and the whole country is being taxed to support this. If the power companies are doing this on their own and the companies producing this are working within the free market and not taking free money to hold cost down I&#8217;m all for it. That&#8217;s not what&#8217;s happening though. On one side the competing industries are being taxed out of business. Cheaper fuels are not being allowed to be used or processed and alternate fuels are being helped. I won&#8217;t even speculate how much money is being scraped off in the process. 

Bottom line is Villa is correct. If I lived in southern California and I was given the option for huge cost savings by singing a deal that&#8217;s too good to be true, I would do the same thing. As long as my individual number improved that&#8217;s all I would be concerned about. Just know that things that seem unrelated IMHO all factor in. Things like $4.00 gal gas is 4 and not 3 say to manipulate energy cost making free solar free. 

The old saying pay me now or pay me later is still true.


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## slownsteady (Aug 7, 2014)

You also have to consider topography & geography in the equation. I had a brief talk with a solar sales rep about two yrs ago. As soon as I explained where I live he said not to bother. Too many trees, too many hills. The amount of time that the sun will actually fall on your panels is a major factor.

Bud; I get your point on market forces and gov't funding of these projects. But if you factor in world politics (and you have to factor that in) the middle east already has too much of our money. Petroleum based economics are fueling much of the trouble in that part of the world.


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