# total replacement of roof....



## shan2themax

I know that this is a wide and broad question... but humor me.... worst case scenario to replace an entire roofing system.... rafters to shingles... ( I will do the gutters myself).... the house has a 5/12 pitch... is 50x29 ish and has a 10X20 screened in porch on the back.... the pictures of it are in my gallery if you want to look... I just need a dollar amount so I am not so shocked when I get the estimates back..... (are three estimates enough... or should I get more....and ... if the rafters need replaced am I better off witha  construction company or a roofing company or does it matter either way)

thanks in advance!!!!!!!!!


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## cibula11

May I ask why you are replacing the entire roof, rafters and all?

Get as many estimates as you can.  3 might be enough,  but the 4th could be the best estimate.  

I can't offer any suggestions on the rafter price, but looking at your house and assuming that there is only one layer of shingles, you are probably looking at $4,000-6,000 for the roof (tearing off shingles and replacing).  The rafters and new sheathing would be on top of that.  Again, that is extremely rough and local estimates would provide you with the best estimates.
( it could be upwards of $10,000 for all that you want done)


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## shan2themax

cibula11 said:


> May I ask why you are replacing the entire roof, rafters and all?
> 
> Get as many estimates as you can.  3 might be enough,  but the 4th could be the best estimate.
> 
> I can't offer any suggestions on the rafter price, but looking at your house and assuming that there is only one layer of shingles, you are probably looking at $4,000-6,000 for the roof (tearing off shingles and replacing).  The rafters and new sheathing would be on top of that.  Again, that is extremely rough and local estimates would provide you with the best estimates.
> ( it could be upwards of $10,000 for all that you want done)



okay... so, I got two estimates so far... One of them was for 4 grand.. this was to remove shingles, 15# felt, 30 year shingles, drip edge and extra layers at valley(extra layers at the valleys doesnt sound like a good idea)... the second one was  6 grand.... that included new decking (osb), 30 # felt, drip edge, new ridge vent, removal and disposal of what is torn off... ice stuff for the valleys.. (i forgot what it was called) 30 year shingles removal of the square vents, recutting of the boards to make a larger opening for the ridge vent....

first estimate roofer looked inside the attic, said the boards showed 'burns' from heat where ridge vent wasnt allowed to vent properly... second guy  seemed to know all that already without actually looking inside the attic.... he was more concerned with putting new decking up than the first guy... which... I saw what the decking looked like underneath and it was dark..... the rafter look brand new though..... so that was great!!!! I am trying to get two more estimates.... but trying to close on the house and get more than two days off in a row is hard..... 

does the second estimate sound reasonable considering????  I was more comfortable with number two... he gave me insurance info, references, pictures and that sort of thing while he was introducing himself..... the other guy just wanted to talk about the number of nails in the plywood and how much extra they charge per sheet in order to make money....

I personally would feel better having new decking put up... to me... it is obvious that it is failing the way it is.. .and I cant see putting 4 grand into something that isnt in pretty good shape to beging with... my only concern was ... does the original wood need to come off... guy #2 was talking about just putting new wood over existing... after the shingles and stuff were removed of course.....


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## cibula11

Do you have  gaps in your current roof decking.  i.e. there would be NO osb plywood under the shingles but 1x6 or 8's spaced apart.  This was a common practice on older homes.  

If the roof is spaced, then yes it is okay to just put the new OSB on top of the existing roof.  If, there is plywood sheathing, they NO it needs to be taken up first.  $6,000 sounds pretty good.  

It is very true that if you have a weak roof decking, you would be better to toss your $4K into a garbage can then to use it to replace the roofing.  If the decking is bad, replace it and the shingles.


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## shan2themax

cibula11 said:


> Do you have  gaps in your current roof decking.  i.e. there would be NO osb plywood under the shingles but 1x6 or 8's spaced apart.  This was a common practice on older homes.
> 
> If the roof is spaced, then yes it is okay to just put the new OSB on top of the existing roof.  If, there is plywood sheathing, they NO it needs to be taken up first.  $6,000 sounds pretty good.
> .



I am not sure if I understand what you mean by spaced.... I want to say guy #1 said 22 inch centers... I will have to look... the wood that is currently up there sways inbetween the rafters... if that makes sense.... I dont know if you can tell from my gallery picture of the front of the house or not.... 

Also, I will try to take a picture from the attic opening this weekend, so that you can see the boards....

if we remove the original plywood, I am sure that will add another 1000 to the cost..... so.... in the event we just put OSB overtop of what is there.... is it a really bad thing?  

I can work with worst case... it is thinking things are good and finding out they arent that I dont deal with well....


the house was built in 1979


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## shan2themax

ok.. I know it has been a long time since I said I would post Pictures... just havent had the time.... but here they are now...

http://www.flickr.com/photos/shan2themax/

looking at the picture it looks to me that the ridge beam is cut?  Or maybe it wasnt long enough and that is the next section.... Is that supposed to be that way? Doesnt look like a good idea to me... but then again I am not a roofer.  

I am really at a loss for what to do (have the old wood torn off or not).  I really really want it torn off.... just not sure if I can afford it, I cant seem to get a roofing company to give me a price for total tear off.......


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## shan2themax

Just bumping in hopes of a response since I added pictures


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## inspectorD

The ridge is typical...no issues there. The black stuff on the underside of the plywood is a fungi which delaminates the plywood after time. You need more ventilation in the attic area. Soffit and ridge vents would be best. Then close off the gable vents because they cause convection disruptions in the air.(whew)

Also check to see that All of your bathroom fans ,vents and other fans exhaust all air to the outside and not into the attic. This is a big problem of adding moisture into the attic space. I have seen some large icicles hangin in the winter...in the attic. 
If the roof is ready for new wood..when you walk it will crack...don't let someone sell you something you don't need. Sometimes a few pieces have had it though...you be the questionair with any roofers. Get a good one.


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## shan2themax

inspectorD said:


> If the roof is ready for new wood..when you walk it will crack...don't let someone sell you something you don't need. Sometimes a few pieces have had it though...you be the questionair with any roofers. Get a good one.



it does crack when you walk on it... I got another quote for new wood at $5600, he said he would remove the old but I havent gotten the paper estimate yet so I am not sure that that will happen. He also said three days which seemed reasonable.

As far as exhaust fans, the only one in the house is over the stove, I will have to go up there one day and see if it goes outside, but honestly, I dont think it does, I only remember seeing the exhaust for plumbing and I dont see anything going from the kitchen to that area.,...... an exhaust fan in the full bathroom is another of my future projects


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## shan2themax

Ok, so..... I have yet to fix this roof..... I wish that one of you know how kinda guys lived close and you could come over... look at it.. shake me and tell me what to do....  This is what I know...... the roof needs replaced..... this is my problem..... is the decking in such bad shape that it needs to be torn off.... ?   one contractor says yes, one says no.... yet another one says... put metal over it... it wont matter.....   I want my home to last... I dont intend to move anytime soon, and as crazy as this sounds.... I have found a way to be able to afford a little more fix.... I have to go back to college.... so that I can defer my student loans and have more money to spend on a monthly payment yet feel more comfortable......  what can I do.... so inside the attic. to see if the plywood that is up there is good? other than the active leak over the half bath (which isnt in use) the wood visually looks okay, with the exception of being blackened... which you can see in my gallery.......

someone shake me..... tell me what you would do........ remove or add on to existing plywood.... (ps they are 24 in center rafters)


I need shaken shannon syndrome.... hurrry.....lol


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## travelover

Shan2,

How about hiring an independent house inspector to take a look at your roof and tell you if you need new decking? I believe they charge about $350 to do a whole house inspection - maybe they'd just do this assessment for a lesser fee? 

If you don't need the decking, it would save more than the inspection fee. And if you do, at least you'll know you did the right thing.


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## inspectorD

You took the words right out of my keyboard....

Most will charge an hourly rate....about $175 up here. Really good inexpensive advice .


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## pgriz

It's probably getting late in the season, and don't know if you have already commited yourself, but...

It's not clear to me what kind of sheathing you have on your roof.  Is it OSB or plywood, or planks?  What thickness?  Do you have any pictures of the wood from inside the attic?  You mentioned that the wood looked dark.  That could be due to mold, or other causes.  Mold usually means that there is condensation in your attic which is supporting the growth of the mold.  The condensation may be a result of persistent leakage (through roof or flashings), and/or due to improper entry of moist air (bathroom vent or kitchen vent), and/or due to insufficient ventilation. 

If the wood is cracking when you walk on it, you may have thin plywood (3/8inch or so) which has partly delaminated (due to leakage from above), and the cracks you hear is the remaining glue holding the plies together breaking.  If the wood is delaminated, but not moldy, it can be sheathed over.  If it is delaminated AND moldy, it's probably best to remove it, and redeck (resheath) with new plywood (I prefer 1/2 inch or more).  To make all those decisions, you really need to find either a good home inspector, or pay a good roofer for his/her professional advice.

I'd suggest you don't sign any contract until you get a clear explanation from a roofer as to what exactly is happening, what contributed to the problems, and what solution they propose that will resolve the problems.  It doesn't hurt to ask them to refer to a former customer (or even two) of theirs that had the same problem as you for whom they fixed the problems.  Then you can get a clearer idea from the former customers whether the roofer's advice was/is worth following.

Good Luck.


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## shan2themax

pgriz..... I have had several estimates... only one of them was willing to take all of the wood off and start all over again... that est was 9000 for 19 squares..... one person got in the attic, he said some of the plywood needed replaced.  (I am not sure of thickness... cant get to an area to tell how thick it is ... any suggestions?).... it is plywood,  the house is 28 years old and the rafters look to be 22-24 inches apart.  
here is a picture of the roof deck 
http://www.flickr.com/photos/shan2themax/999833668/


I have temporarily fixed the leak... so hopefull I can wait till feb, march to do the roof (i will be better able to afford 9000 then also)


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## pgriz

If there's an opening cut through the roof (vent, pipe stack, etc.), the cut is usually square, and it's possible to measure the thickness of an exposed edge.

Saw your photo, and the decking is definitely darker than I would expect.  I've uploaded three photos in my gallery that look closely at the deck.  Each photo is from a different house, and shows different things.  Have a look and see if there's anything there that looks like your situation.

Personally, until you find a roofer who can explain everything to you (what issues he found on your roof, what corrective action he's recommending, exactly how will he fix each issue), I'd hold off on engaging a roofer.  As I noted earlier, try to get the roofer to tell you about other customers who had your type of problem and then call them up and find out if in fact the roofer diagnosed the problem correctly and then fixed it.


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## shan2themax

the roofing god said:


> will you pay traveling expenses ??



that may be tempting when I am at the point that I can do it....  I'll keep you in mind... only one company here was willing to do a total tear off..  as for ventilation.... you are on the money... no right now... the bathrooms do not have ventilation (other than plumbing)... I will be adding that... but the kitchen hood has been dumping ventilation up there for 30 years... so i bought a new one that does not ventilate up into the attic... it just comes out the top of the range hood.... Hopefully that will slow down what is already going on.   and again thanks for your replies...I think that you will be a good assest along with all the other greats on this forum!!!!!!!!!


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## prodigymytch

First off, let me say you have a beautiful house. 

I roofed for about a year. I wasn't the contractor but I learned what I should. I can't give you a "deal price" cos I'm in a small town, and it's cheaper here, (I think).

I will say that even with replacing the decking, your house looks like an easy house to do.  With the summer coming around, you might seeing if you can't find some people you know to make a project out of it. You only need one person who knows how to roof to teach everyone else. Tearing off is really no issue. And the cost of shingles can save you thousands of dollars.


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## bubbajoebo

My Wife and I are in the same position with our roof. After talking to some roofers and contractors and looking in the attic, we are going to have to remove all the decking (1925 house), scab the rafters, and put a new roof on. One guy said he could just put a metal roof on top of it but would still fix the rotten wood just because of mold issues down the line. Any opinions... we can see daylight (the size of a basketball) in one area and when you walk on the roof I swear I'm gonna fall through it is so unstable/rotted. Thanks yall, glad to join the forum, the roof is 30sq with gables and every estimate is near $10-12k.


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## quiltmaster

I'm bumping this because I'm in the same situation.  We have what has been described as the worst case of powder post beetles the inspector has ever seen.  They are in the rafters.  He has suggested getting a structural engineer ot to do a repair plan. but the most simple fix is to rebuild the roof from the rafters up.  We have 1500 sq ft, live in Florida and have asphalt shingles.  

I too would like a ball-park estimate before I start dealing with contractors if anyone can help.  Thanks in advance.
Anthony


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## DaveyDIY

Get local estimates
Prices vary widely by area


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