# The Mysterious Drip



## Msupsic (Apr 10, 2015)

Hi Friends, wondering if you can help me solve a mystery.

I live in a 70 year-old contemporary with exposed beams on the first floor. For that reason, the second floor bathroom is raised up on a platform to accommodate the plumbing (see diagram)

We&#8217;ve been getting a slow, steady drip from underneath the upstairs tub, down through the floor into the living room. It only happens when we use the shower, which leads me to believe that it&#8217;s not a steady leak.

The drip does not happen on every instance. It typically happens after longer showers or when my wife and I are in there together. It begins about ten minutes into the shower and continues for a few minutes after the water has been shut off.

My first thought was that it was the plumbing. I replaced the gaskets, put in fresh putty and tightened all compression joints. I&#8217;ve checked for leaks, even checked that old-school trap and everything is clear and dry.

To make sure it wasn't the drain or overflow, I turned on the tub spigot and let it run straight into the drain for about ten minutes. No drips that way. So, it&#8217;s only when we take a shower.

After a few weeks monitoring the situation, I learned that the water is coming off of the front corner of the tub, INSIDE the wall.

There is a slight amount of deflection when someone stands in the tub, even more so when two are in it. My suspicion is that the caulk around the tub is failing and when one or two of us gets in the tub, we pull the seal apart and let water in along the edge of the tub. It gets behind the wall and runs along the lip of the tub and down to the lowest corner, into the interior cavity.

The duct tape in the photo was an experiment to see if the leak was along the faucet side wall. It did slow the drip down, but not completely.

Any ideas what is going on here?


----------



## nealtw (Apr 10, 2015)

Make sure you are not leaking from the shower pipe inside the wall, check the caulk around the spout and the control and poke at the drywall behind the tile to see if it is soft. Check the grout for voids maybe seal  that.
I know you have done most of that then re-caulk the tub all the way around.
Are you sure it isn't just spashout at the end of the curtain.
Get a curved curtain rod, you mount them closer in they close up the end better and give you alot mor elbow room while you are in there.


----------



## Msupsic (Apr 10, 2015)

Good Point, I'll check that too. Since it only happens when we shower I'm definitely thinking it's some kind of splash back onto the wall and into a breach somewhere. Thanks for your help.


----------



## frodo (Apr 10, 2015)

places to check

the spout to wall

the face plate to wall

the wall to tub caulking

shower curtain to wall..

from the look of the leak,,i suspect wall to edge of tub,,or  showere curtain...install glass doors

is the wall water proofed with membrane?


----------



## slownsteady (Apr 10, 2015)

If the tub is moving ("deflection") then any repair will be temporary. You should stabilize the thing at your earliest opportunity.


----------



## frodo (Apr 11, 2015)

in the picture,  its a cast iron tub..

                                               I do not understand deflection of cast iron  ...please explain


----------



## joecaption (Apr 11, 2015)

Anyone else notice it looks like tile installed over just drywall?
The corrosion on the old bronze drains that at some point always leak?
Cast tub just sitting on what looks like rotted 1 X's, and there's even one missing at the front edge of the tub?
Sure looks like some under sized floor joist.
Looks like no bottom plate under the short side wall.
The back side of the drywall damage from leaking trim ring and tub spout.


----------



## bud16415 (Apr 11, 2015)

frodo said:


> in the picture, its a cast iron tub..
> 
> I do not understand deflection of cast iron ...please explain


 

The tub might not be deflecting but there is movement so the structure under it is deflecting. So lets say the tub is rocking.


----------



## Msupsic (Apr 11, 2015)

Thanks for all of the suggestions. Frodo, as Bud says it's not the tub moving, the support system under the tub is probably moving a bit (especially if the wood is rotting as it appears to be). The house is 70 years old and this tub looks like it could be at least 40.

I have no idea what's behind the walls/tile. This was here when we bought the house 12 years ago. My gut feeling (based on other jobs I've done in the house) is that they did not do this the right way.

I think first priority is to shore up the tub with a few shims/studs or something and then re-caulk around the tub. Maybe get a different shower curtain. I'm really feeling like that leak is coming from the caulk/grout line along the front edge.


----------



## frodo (Apr 11, 2015)

from the looks of the rotted wood..and a surprising 2x6 ??? floor joist.

anything you do besides pulling the tub and repairing the structure.  is,,,well to be blunt


piss'n in the wind

IMO,    demo the tile,  pull the tub.  remove all rotted wood,  reframe,

replace the tub..and have it refinished.   install a new drain and valve. 

install Schluter water proof membrane system on walls....retile .


----------



## havasu (Apr 11, 2015)

I have to agree with frodo. Looks like a demo to do things correctly.


----------



## Msupsic (Apr 12, 2015)

Thanks, we've been kicking that idea around for a complete rebuild, for a few years anyway. Looks like it's time.

For now, I'm just looking for ways to stop the leak so it doesn't further the damage, until we can find a contractor and get a design plan together. It's the only shower in the house and it'll really make life difficult the longer it's out of commission.


----------



## nealtw (Apr 12, 2015)

Let's not over kill this thing.
The rotting structure spoke of can be inspected from the access panel, with something sharp poke at the floor joist under the edge of the tub.

That maybe drywall behind the tile, can be proved from the access panel. if it is drywall it shows no water damage as it would be grey not white.

The drywall or?? sits on the top of the flange so water running along the back of the lip does not real hurt anything in there.

Re-caulk and tape the curtain to that end and see if the problem goes away.


----------



## frodo (Apr 12, 2015)

a cut of a tub,,,see the lip /flange on the tub?   if your tub is leaking around that lip.

caulk will stop it for now..it is just a band aid...not a permanent fix.   caulk is for making stuff look purdy,  not fixing leaks

I would pull that outta there and make a walk in shower  :beer:


----------



## Msupsic (Apr 13, 2015)

Thanks for taking the time to do that diagram. I put a bunch of duct tape (very scientific) over the lip of the tub and the leaking has slowed significantly. So I'm 99% sure this is where the water is coming in.

It will be good to stop the leak for now. But in the long run, we'll have to redo the bathroom. Believe it or not, there are two layers of tile in there. The genius who did the remodel in the 90's just stuck the existing tile over the old stuff. There has to be about a ton of tile hanging on the walls of our bathroom. Gotta love it.


----------



## Msupsic (Apr 21, 2015)

My little duct tape experiment reduced the leak significantly, but not completely. So I my first thought was, "More tape." As I was placing the tape, I found this hole under the spigot.

I think we may have our answer. Don't know how I missed it before. But it makes sense that the water wold be running down the back wall, around the spigot and right into this hole. I'm curious to see if caulking it up will stop the problem.

Thanks for your help and suggestions, everyone. Will let you know.


----------



## frodo (Apr 21, 2015)

frodo said:


> places to check
> 
> the spout to wall
> 
> ...




look at the first on the list.:banana::beer:


----------



## Msupsic (Apr 21, 2015)

from the look of the leak,,i suspect wall to edge of tub,,or showere curtain...install glass doors

Thats where I started. When it didnt fix the problem, I moved to the other points. Things take time, Frodo.

The good news is that I think were onto something here. Thats the goal, right? To fix the problem?


----------



## Msupsic (Apr 22, 2015)

OK, so last night I removed the old caulk from around the spigot and replaced with new stuff. Unfortunately did not make a difference, so I guess this was not it. On to the next idea.


----------



## nealtw (Apr 22, 2015)

I like the duct tape, but how well is it stuck to the grout, the lip on the tub runs all the way around so check the caulk all the way around, check the corners where the tile meet, ithe grout often cracks there.


----------



## frodo (Apr 23, 2015)

have you thought of the possibility of a leak in your shower riser?   it would only leak when the shower was on.


----------



## Msupsic (Apr 23, 2015)

Yes. It's definitely a possibility, although I would have expected to see some damage/staining somewhere along the outside wall, too?

If it was leaking from the shower head or the faucet, wouldn't it be running back down the pipe and dripping right into the access area?


----------



## Msupsic (Apr 23, 2015)

nealtw said:


> I like the duct tape, but how well is it stuck to the grout, the lip on the tub runs all the way around so check the caulk all the way around, check the corners where the tile meet, ithe grout often cracks there.



Thanks Neal, will try this next.


----------



## frodo (Apr 23, 2015)

have you given thought to leaking around the shower curton,


----------



## Msupsic (Apr 24, 2015)

Yes. It's a double shower curtain, one hangs inside the tub, one outside. The inside one goes wal-to-wall. You think there might still be drips even with a double curtain?


----------



## frodo (Apr 24, 2015)

yes,  my wife puts that foo foo double,  pink flowered ugly........................

ok,,i'm back,   the outside curtain is just a purdy...the inside can, [mine]  will leak if not draped correctly

best thing,  especially with kids,  get a sliding door


----------

