# how much does block concrete fence cost?



## ann123 (Apr 23, 2014)

425 ft long and 6 ft high.

Was given ridiculously high quotes - about 50 k (labor and material).

Did some research and it seems like it should be around 10-15k.

But can't find anyone in Louisiana with that price.


Any suggestions? What's the fair price for that kind of job?


Thanks in advance


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## oldognewtrick (Apr 23, 2014)

First off Ann,  to House Repair Talk.

50k to much? I don't know, it might not be enough. What type of soil conditions do you have? Is there a footer there already or are they going to have to pour a new one? And who said 10-15 is a fair price? Are they willing to do it for that? 

I know, a lot of questions. We're more than happy to help, but trying to guess a price is like guessing how long is a string.


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## Wuzzat? (Apr 23, 2014)

http://www.homewyse.com/services/cost_to_install_concrete_block_wall.html
For a place in NJ where the median household income is $68K and with 2550 sf of wall I get ~$25K.

For New Orleans, Estimated median household income in 2011: $35,041 so you'd pay 35 x 25K/68 = ~$13K.
http://www.google.com/search?client=safari&rls=en&q="new+orleans"+city+data&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8
but you should reuse the calculators with your own ZIPcode.
http://www.google.com/search?client...rete+block+fence+calculator&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8


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## guyod (Apr 23, 2014)

That site does not say anything about a footer.  I dont know what the frost line in louisiana is but 425ft of footer plus block to get up to grade will easily cost 10k-15k extra.


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## Wuzzat? (Apr 23, 2014)

http://www.soundfootings.com/pdf/US_Map_Frost_DepthAVG.pdf

There must be a footer calculator somewhere.


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## guyod (Apr 23, 2014)

That chart is way off for me. Most of PA is 36" or below. Chart say most of PA is 20"


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## mudmixer (Apr 23, 2014)

In LA, the footing cost may not be cheap. The frost is not factor, but the soils can be so horrible that the footings for 6' high privacy wall the cost goes up because of the history of winds that will tip it over easily. In NO and along the river, the mucky soil, water and possible winds make it difficult. If it does blow over, put some horizontal steel in it so it can be used as a sidewalk later.

Dick


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## ann123 (Apr 23, 2014)

Here are some details:


425 feet long, the height =  6 ft

60 feet of the wall will be higher - 8 ft.

22 feet will be brick (to match the house at front).

6 ft gate at back side.


Important: water should drain well through



There is no footer, so they'll probably need to pour a new one. Don't know about soil condition. Right now it's a yard with grass on it, it was a new construction site..

As for 10-15k.. It's per different calculators found on the web.. and per common sense. I don't believe it should cost that much. Unless they're trying to bill us $500.00 per hour... But maybe I am wrong; that's why I created this thread.


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## nealtw (Apr 23, 2014)

I don't know if you need permits for that or not but the city inspectors are a good source of information. They will know something about soil conditions and have some idea about what you might need for a footer. Up here we would be sent straight to an engineer.
It's always best to know what you need so you dictate how it will be done before you get quotes. Otherwise you will get quotes with different plans so you can't compare them.
Then come back and see what people here think of the plan.


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## Wuzzat? (Apr 24, 2014)

guyod said:


> That chart is way off for me. Most of PA is 36" or below. Chart say most of PA is 20"


It seems to understate for my area, too.
20" might be the depth reached half the time, with 3' being that reached less than 10% of the time.


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## bud16415 (Apr 24, 2014)

I don&#8217;t know about the calculators and how the formula works they are based on, I&#8217;m sure part math and part tables. 

You need to take into account each task you will be asking for and materials. Basically you need 4300 blocks and about 14 yards of footer. Price it out. You will need a survey of some kind and excavation wide enough to get in and form the footer, base material may need to be added and compacted, and build maybe 4 course of blocks below grade. You will have a cost for forms, rebar, pouring and finishing. Depending on access you have to figure how the material is getting back there. Will it have to be pumped or carted back etc. then you will have a cost per block to lay. And a cost to finish the wall. Will it be capped and painted. Coated or left to look like block. It then has to be all back filled excess material removed and cleaned up.   

It&#8217;s a bigger project than one may think. I would get as many quotes as I could and have each one tell you exactly what their plan is. Or better yet get the plan figured in advance and then have everyone quote to what you expect it to be.


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## Wuzzat? (Apr 24, 2014)

What are reasonable upper limits the OP should pay for this, all things considered?


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## nealtw (Apr 24, 2014)

Exactly the amount they write the check for.


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## Wuzzat? (Apr 25, 2014)

nealtw said:


> Exactly the amount they write the check for.



I'll rephrase the question, your honor. . .

Does anyone besides the OP feel that $50k is too much for this job?


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## havasu (Apr 25, 2014)

I feel it is too much. Problem is, there is no exact details what they plan on doing to justify this expenditure.


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## bud16415 (Apr 25, 2014)

Is it too much? I don&#8217;t know. 

I can tell you I would never pay 50k for a fence of any kind. 

I think Neal&#8217;s conjecture is the amount people will charge and or pay is subject to many factors some of them measurable and tangible, others not so much. The richest person on earth might not think twice spending 100 times that on his security or privacy. A contractor with several years of backlog might double his price to make it worth it if the consumer really needs it bad enough. In my last post I more or less itemized what would go into this job and someone could price that all out and take a swag at the labor and equipment costs. I don&#8217;t know maybe 5 minutes to lay one block that&#8217;s 358 man hours assuming we get some really cheap labor at $20 per hour that&#8217;s over $7,000 right there. I know a block layer can go faster and I also know the labor cost is more like $60 to $100  per hour most likely. I don&#8217;t know what a block costs but a look on line could itemize all the hard stuff. 

I just bought 40 poles for $1.50 each to use for a fence I&#8217;m building.


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## havasu (Apr 25, 2014)

I do know locally there are many cheaper alternatives to build a fence. My local big box store sells ready built 6' tall fencing, in everything from wood, to PVC, metal and other materials. With a $50K price, I myself would be looking at all the alternatives, along with at least two other bids from the specific area.


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## mudmixer (Apr 25, 2014)

Without any real details like like location, site access, soil type, depth to water, it could be a bargain or too high.

The footing could be 8" to 12" thick and 18" to 48" wide, the wall could be 6" or 8" thick with or without pilasters if it not on piling. I have seen some walls that had poor access so excavated and replacement soil had to be wheeled in and out and footing concrete pumped over the roof of the home.

In any event, the wall will have to be reinforced (16" to 48" on centers).

A common privacy wall in southern CA or AZ is 6" high with reinforcement at 24" o.c. and 24" wide (minimum) footing 8" thick with the bottom of the footing about 2' down. - That is for reasonably good soil. Going up to 8' high gets much costlier because of the wall design and overturning from wind.

If it is on or abutting a neighbor, the cost goes up.

Dick


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## havasu (Apr 25, 2014)

Well said Dick!


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## nealtw (Apr 25, 2014)

Wuzzat? said:


> I'll rephrase the question, your honor. . .
> 
> Does anyone besides the OP feel that $50k is too much for this job?



Like Dick pointed out, there are to many unknowns.

The OP can get three of four quote from contractors with their different plans and then try to sort out who has the best story and or price.

Or the OP can have an engineer design the job and all the contractors get to quote the same job..

In the end anything is worth what someone will pay for it.


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## nealtw (Apr 25, 2014)

Keep in mind the reason that most people use a contractor that will look after the whole job is because they don't really know what needs to be done. If the contractor has all the people and equipment to do the job, he may have people that can do more than one of those jobs but he has to charge enough to pay for equipment that isn't used ever day.  More often he will have people that do the core work and sub out the rest. The advantage of haver a plan to start with is that you can cut up the job and get quotes on all parts of the job. A back hoe to prep the trench look after drainage and back fill when done. Any framer, most construction labourer or carpenter can build forms and pore the footings. Then you need a brick layer.
All of these people are the sub contractors that the general contractor use and they will have time between jobs for work like this.
The down side of doing it like this you may have to deal with 20 or 30 people to get all the quotes and then the job may take a little long as not everyone will be available on your time line.
If it is just a matter of saving money???


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## Wuzzat? (Apr 25, 2014)

nealtw said:


> In the end anything is worth what someone will pay for it.



Yes, subject to 

Definition of 'Arm's Length Transaction'
A transaction in which the buyers and sellers of a product act independently and have no relationship to each other. The concept of an arm's length transaction is to ensure that both parties in the deal are acting in their own self interest and are not subject to any pressure or duress from the other party. 

and

Fair market value (FMV) is an estimate of the market value of a [project] based on what a knowledgeable, willing, and unpressured buyer would probably pay to a knowledgeable, willing, and unpressured seller in the market.


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## nealtw (Apr 25, 2014)

Wuzzat? said:


> Yes, subject to
> 
> Definition of 'Arm's Length Transaction'
> A transaction in which the buyers and sellers of a product act independently and have no relationship to each other. The concept of an arm's length transaction is to ensure that both parties in the deal are acting in their own self interest and are not subject to any pressure or duress from the other party.
> ...



You've never been a door to to door salesman.


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## Wuzzat? (Apr 26, 2014)

nealtw said:


> You've never been a door to to door salesman.


Did telemarketing for a while 
And when we were kids we tried to sell packets of Christmas Cards door to door to get a radio controlled airplane.  It didn't go well.


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## BridgeMan (Apr 28, 2014)

Wuzzat? said:


> Did telemarketing for a while
> And when we were kids we tried to sell packets of Christmas Cards door to door to get a radio controlled airplane.  It didn't go well.



I was in the same boat as a 10-year-old, trying to sell Christmas cards.  Hadn't had a sale all weekend, despite lugging the stupid card samples all around town for many hours.  So when this rich woman invited me into her elegant front foyer late on a Sunday afternoon (to wait while she finished a phone call), my hopes were up.  I waited, and waited, and waited some more--must have been standing there listening to the old biddy gab for half an hour.  Finally, nature called, and I had to take a leak, real bad.  I ran out the front door, and hoofed it up the street to my house, making it just in time to avoid wetting my pants.  Never did make that sale, as I was too embarrassed to go back and explain my hasty exit.


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## BridgeMan (Apr 28, 2014)

But I digress, and sorry for the side-tracking from the OP's original post.

I would suggest getting a disinterested but knowledgeable and experienced engineer to work up a simple set of plans/specifications for the project, based on local codes and soil conditions.  Then proceed to solicit bids from qualified bidders.  Doing so will mean comparing apples to apples, instead of getting different bids from different bidders, each with his or her own ideas of what the job requires.

I had a somewhat similar experience a few years ago.  As a "pro bono" offer, I worked up a set of plans and specs for a motel entryway safety railing project.  The woman who owned the motel provided us with reasonable rates and a decent place to stay for several weeks in the area while we were home-shopping.  She realized she had a safety hazard at the entryway (it had a 3', very abrupt drop-off just outside the entry door), but thus far all the contractors she talked to had given her numbers (and ideas) all over the ball park.  Using the bid package I gave her, she proceeded to solicit bids from area contractors, and picked one who did a respectable job on fabricating and installing the railing.  She was delighted with the results, and marveled at how easy it was to have a detailed package of what was required for all of the bidders to use.


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## Wuzzat? (Apr 28, 2014)

BridgeMan said:


> So when this rich woman invited me into her elegant front foyer late on a Sunday afternoon


Had you been older this might have gone completely differently, if you get my drift. . .


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## mako1 (Apr 29, 2014)

I would not touch this job for 15k. 4300 block will run around 5K in this area.14 yards of concrete would be $1540.
You will need rebar for the footing and depending on local codes at least one piece of vertical rebar every 4 feet in a poured cell.Wood or rented forms for the footing.Mortar and a lot of other incidentals.Permits and a soil test.
See where I'm headed here?This includes no labor or equipment.You will probably have a minimum of $2000 in a nice gate depending on type and size.


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## Wuzzat? (Apr 30, 2014)

mako1 said:


> I would not touch this job for 15k.


Choose a bid. . .
20K
30K (1.5 x 20)
45K (1.5 x 30)
70K (1.5 x 45)

Anybody?

I'd say the OP is looking for a non-precision answer between 15 and 50 and the city data for median income for Peoria is only slightly higher than that for New Orleans so your estimate is somewhat applicable to the OP's situation.

Pretty soon I'll bid on it and I don't know diddly about this type of work.  What harm can it do? My advice is worth every penny paid for it!


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## BridgeMan (Apr 30, 2014)

It's been a week since the OP responded to our comments, so maybe she just gave up on us.  I don't think she'll get her fence built for the ten or fifteen grand she somehow thinks it should cost., but I'm not about to guess at a number (that wouldn't be very meaningful anyway).


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## nealtw (Apr 30, 2014)

BridgeMan said:


> It's been a week since the OP responded to our comments, so maybe she just gave up on us.  I don't think she'll get her fence built for the ten or fifteen grand she somehow thinks it should cost., but I'm not about to guess at a number (that wouldn't be very meaningful anyway).



Have you noticed the price finders always leave when they don't get the right answers and never come back to tell us what they ended up doing.


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## Wuzzat? (Apr 30, 2014)

My guess for the center value for several bids would be sqrt(15K x 50K) = 27K and I'd modify this estimate according to Web opinions and Web facts while correcting it for locale.

If the low bid/high bid were closer together, like 15K and 25K, I guess I'd say (15K + 25K)/2 = 20K for a center value.

If I'd guess between $1K and $200K for an interval estimate, almost certainly this would be right. 
Right now the lower end of this interval estimate seem to be >$15K.


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## nealtw (Apr 30, 2014)

Wuzzat? said:


> My guess for the center value for several bids would be sqrt(15K x 50K) = 27K and I'd modify this estimate according to Web opinions and Web facts while correcting it for locale.
> 
> If the low bid/high bid were closer together, like 15K and 25K, I guess I'd say (15K + 25K)/2 = 20K for a center value.
> 
> ...



It dosn't matter, what ever information they get from here, it would be a guess at best or ads on line would only find a salesperson to come out and expand the price when they get there.

They still have to deal with contractors and there ideas or develope a plan to get quotes on. Whether the job done is good or bad the answer is still the same. It will be worth what they pay for it. There is no shortcut.


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## Wuzzat? (Apr 30, 2014)

http://robertreich.org/post/79512527145

I guess what I'm offering is different but logic-based ways of interpreting the bids you get.  It can't hurt, the OP can always decide I'm full of it.  

Resumes don't seem to matter much on forums, anyway. . .


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