# Inventions



## inspectorD (Jan 18, 2008)

Has anyone here ever invented something. I am thinking of inventing something and would like their stories, good and bad.
How you went about it and any pitfalls.


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## ToolGuy (Jan 18, 2008)

I invented a ******** that when plugged into a standard wall outlet would ******* in 5 different *******. However, I haven't patented it yet so it's still a secret. I call it a *****ulating ******itator.


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## inspectorD (Jan 18, 2008)

I already have one of those....save your money.


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## ToolGuy (Jan 18, 2008)

Me and my big mouth.


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## disenyo (Jan 28, 2008)

I have never invented something but I am quite very interested on what you are going to invent. What do you intend to invent?


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## inspectorD (Jan 28, 2008)

Something.....well ....inventive.


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## CraigFL (Jan 28, 2008)

Everything I've invented was related to part of my job so I didn't have to worry about patenting, marketing or costs...   But of course I didn't get any of the profits either...


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## Hack (Jan 28, 2008)

There are about 50 patents with my name on them.  I'm listed as the "primary" inventor on 4 or 5.  All of them are work related...so they're of little interest here, but look good on the resume


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## inspectorD (Jan 28, 2008)

I have lots of ideas for things...but don't know who to trust.
The biggest thing I am concerned about is how are they trying to scam you out of money up front. And how do you know when to give the patent person the idea..?? I was wondering if someone has gone through some of these issues ,and any pitfalls.


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## kok328 (Jan 28, 2008)

I kinda figured you just don't set out to invent "something".  I always figured you stumble onto something and then coin it.  If you have a sure fire idea and are rightfully hesitant to reveal it without having it stolen, then find an attorney to write you up some disclosure agreements to have signed with whoever you decide to share your idea with.
Having watch the TV show "American Inventor", it seems like some good ideas just weren't good enough.  I think you'll need a certain percentage of population interest before you can find a backer$.


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## phreaq (Jan 31, 2008)

when I was kid I had all sorts of inventions, not many worked (most involved magnets, lol). It wasn't until later in life that I learned the laws of physics and realized why my inventions didn't work.

What do you consider an invention? If you're looking for a patent the idea cannot already exist, or it needs to be a large fundamental improvement over an existing patent. 

I worked as a mechanical designer in the automotive field for about a decade, which I could argue involved inventing, since the machines I designed never existed before. We did go for a few patents, and the costs involved were enormous! Many legal and research fees made it pretty much pointless to pursue. The product was for quite a niche market, a rotary actuator that had built in 'cushions' (normally you need external decelerators, and these were not done by springs/shocks but a rather complex CAM profile)


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## inspectorD (Jan 31, 2008)

I'm just rollin the ball around...collecting my ideas. 
I guess in a nutshell, you need to have something which is not around ...as we see it used.
You need alot of money for a patent lawyer, and any lengthly legwork they may do.

So I better have a grand idea,,,and lots of capital,,,to risk it all,,, and see if it is needed. 

The catch is....how do you find the market, if you can't tell anyone about the product.

Wanted....one paddle for missing boat somewhere up creek.


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## guyod (Jan 31, 2008)

What came first the chicken or the lawyer??


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## CraigFL (Feb 1, 2008)

First you "disclose" the idea to a colleague by collecting all the paperwork that was involved in the concept, get it notorized and have a concept explanation provided to someone who can read it and understand it and sign it to that effect-- with notorization.

Decide where you will papent this invention -- USA, World, etc...

Then you search for prior art -- maybe going back to the first step and modifying.

Apply for patent(s)

Then, market idea. Use legal disclosure statement signed by people you will be talking to that protects you from having them talk about it to others. Be aware that most smaller inventions are best marketed by you because you won't have to reveal to anyone. Besides, it is easier and easier to market to the world using internet and TV as long as you are willing to invest your own money. You can start out small and eventually grow or sell out if it's good.


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## inspectorD (Feb 1, 2008)

Any idea how long a process takes and maybe some numbers?
I know it's a loaded question, but just on the average.
Lets say I invented muffler bearings.... 
This would cost less to patent than a whole car obviously, but what about the costs of the legwork is what I'm curious about.

Any idea where to find someone who can "read the product? Where to start, such as an engineer or someone who has a certain job just looking into this sort of invention idea...besides a lawyer. 
This is very helpful, thanks.


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## CraigFL (Feb 1, 2008)

I can only tell you the lawyers worked for a year each on the two patents I was involved in. Many 1000s of dollars. I hear that some people search and apply for themselves but I think you would have to spend the time to turn yourself into an expert in order to do this. You would have to get familiar with the USPTO way of doing things in order to find similar patents and write yours in a standard way with all the proper references.

You can find a lot of info at:  http://www.uspto.gov/ if you haven't looked already. Check the FAQs.

The real big costs come from foreign patent filings which are more difficult and higher fees. My recollection is that one patent cost over $10,000 for US, Japan and Europe filings.

P.S. Muffler bearings were invented years ago ...


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## inspectorD (Feb 1, 2008)

Thanks again, I had no idea of that site...I'll be reading for a couple of days.
The costs are not prohibitive, I'll be looking into this more seriously now. 
If it works I'll send you one....free.


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## CraigFL (Feb 2, 2008)

inspectorD said:


> ...
> If it works I'll send you one....free.



Please don't... I already have 3 muffler bearings and I haven't installed any of them yet!  


But of course if you could send me some of that muffler bearing grease or a muffler bearing mounting bracket....


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## inspectorD (Feb 2, 2008)

So you probably got them when you googled it....I knew they where out there somewhere. 

  
I can't believe it.....someone actually sells em. $49.99

Back to the idea board.......


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## CraigFL (Feb 2, 2008)

I bought mine from Kale auto along with some blinker fluid I needed...

http://kalecoauto.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=2&products_id=6


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## guyod (Feb 2, 2008)

Thanks for the wild goose chase guys.... I didnt think there was such a thing then i found it for sale online with reviews....


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## inspectorD (Feb 2, 2008)

Make sure you get all the attachments, and some of that elbow grease they sell.....for the bearings. 

Sometimes it is all worth it....


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## ToolGuy (Feb 2, 2008)

I was rofl at that site. They should get their forums going, it would be a real hoot.


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## Hack (Feb 4, 2008)

FWIW, a "provisional" patent gets the gears turning at a much lower cost.  The only catch is that after one year, you either have to take the next step and make it a "utility" patent, or drop it.  We use them all the time to get the early filing date.  We're then allowed to add more information to them as we learn more about a particular design.  If things are panning out, we'll go ahead and convert to a utility patent.  If we're thinking it's not worth it...we drop it.

Provisional patent filing fee is just about $200, unless you're qualified as a "small entity".  If you are a "small entity", it's only $105.

A small entity means an independent inventor, a small business concern, or a nonprofit organization eligible for reduced patent fees...

I'm not a patent attorney.  I did NOT sleep at a Holiday Inn Express last night, so it's probably best to look into this to see what all the costs are.

Good Luck!


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## inspectorD (Feb 4, 2008)

I didn't sleep ...O never mind.. 
Who do you see about these small entity or provisionals....sounds like loiurwyer talc ta lil ol me. 

But it does sound like my kind of direction...to start.


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## OtbHunter (Feb 15, 2008)

I am in the process at this time... Run a Google search and read up on the process. It is not as simple as it sounds. The cost of a patent today will be $5,000.00 or more and take 2-3 years to complete! A friend just finished the process..cost a little over $5,000 and took 3 years! Now he has to find someone that is willing to build the product and give him a share of the profits.


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## Hack (Feb 21, 2008)

Here is the best reference I've found on how to file PPA's.  There's a step by step guide, and everything else you have to know...

Good Luck!

dumblittleman


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## mudmixer (Feb 21, 2008)

The "provisional" approach does have time limits and may cost more in the end.

Another approach is to very carefully document your meetings, discussions, research while you develope or refine your concept and determine the market value and customers. - Anyone can get a patent, but unless you can market it or find a solid partner, you are on an ego trip.

Talk about your initial concept (Phase I) while you are developing the concept of the finished concept. Doing this, any copiers or others that sense a development in a an industry will be looking at the old research, while you are devoping the Phase II, III or IV, which can be shown to be the most recent. - This will give you additional credence to your application.

If you are fortunate enough to get a valuable patent, you will have to be able to defend it against the copiers. Since you have the documented research, meeting notes, comments and contempranious notes, you should easily be able to defend it against the people that copied Phases I if you or your partner have the resources to stop the pirates.

The last patent suit I was involved in had over $760,000 on one side invested in legal fees before I was called a year ago.


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## inspectorD (Feb 21, 2008)

I checked out the site, and it's accoutrement's. It has the basics...just like I imagined them. Everyone always wants a piece of the action. I know your not supposed to talk to anyone about your idea but...I talked to my brother in-law about "an" idea about something. It is a small world...his father in-law is a patent attorney, this is something I was not aware of.
So long story short...we will meet, and come up with the solution...which I will pick his brain about and hopefully get some realistic answers. 
I think my idea is something we in construction will all use, so I want to contribute. If it makes some decent $$, I want to use it to help those folks who need it, to fix their homes. It's the same reason I am on this forum...to help those who need it. You get back what you put in. 
I'll keep you all posted. 
760,000...ouch!!


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## mudmixer (Feb 21, 2008)

During a meeting with an industry aquaintance, I mentioned I was working on a patent. We met a week later and I recognized his wife as working in a major patent attorney's office. They agressively challenge and fight patents with a heavy hand (2 or 3 pages of listed searches, that may or may not have been really analyzed).

Obviously, I talked about Phase Zero of my idea instead of the real idea.

Now I just have to go around him to get the right people above him to talk to about Phase V. - You never know who you are talking to.


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## inspectorD (Feb 24, 2008)

2 years to late....^$#@^@&#&  ^%%*(%(()(
Just when you go lookin around, you find all the ideas are taken. I figured it out when my son was rolling a plate on the floor.
www.arcusblade.com  patent pending....

Back to the other drawing board.


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