# LED Lights



## bolsaboy (Feb 28, 2013)

We installed three LED can lights in our kitchen. all on one circuit with two threeway switches controling them. and they eluminate at different levals. Every time we switch them on a different one is brighter then the others. Any idea what would cause this?


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## Housedoctor57 (Mar 1, 2013)

Not an expert in this area but I believe it is the tolerance of each LED and it's transformer. I have 6 LED cans in my home theater room. They are on a dimmer. As I dim them down, 4 go out and 2 stay barely lit. I can continue to dim and they will go out also. I moved them around in the configuration so they are at the back of the room and illuminate the wet bar area. Accidentally worked out great for me! Not sure why your levels change around. Maybe try a different LED brand.


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## JoeD (Mar 1, 2013)

How did you wire them? Tell us how you ran your cables and what cable you ran between the switches and lights.


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## bolsaboy (Mar 1, 2013)

I'm not sure how they were wired. I do remember the electrician saying that if one bulb was removed none of the remaining ones would light. If that helps.


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## Housedoctor57 (Mar 1, 2013)

bolsaboy said:


> I'm not sure how they were wired. I do remember the electrician saying that if one bulb was removed none of the remaining ones would light. If that helps.



They should not be wired in series.


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## JoeD (Mar 1, 2013)

bolsaboy said:


> I'm not sure how they were wired. I do remember the electrician saying that if one bulb was removed none of the remaining ones would light. If that helps.



That is what I suspected. It means they were not wired correctly. You need to fix the wiring so they are in parallel not in series.


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## nealtw (Mar 1, 2013)

He had an electrision wire it, so maybe you should explain what he should look for.


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## JoeD (Mar 1, 2013)

Removing one bulb indicates that they are wired in series. I have NEVER heard of any lights in a house being wired in series except Christmas tree strings. If it was done by an electrician then he should call a different electrician. It does not sound correct.

Perhaps if some info on the fixtures could be provided that would help. Info on how they were wired would be helpful also but I doubt that is available if not done by the OP.

The most common mistake with three ways and multiple lights is taking a drawing with one light between the switches and trying to do it multiple lights. It is not realized that four wires are needed and not 3 wires to make it work properly. The light end up in series and are dim when turned on. This is what I was suspecting.


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## nealtw (Mar 1, 2013)

You lost me Joe; In order to get them in series you would do it with one wire.


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## JoeD (Mar 1, 2013)

Here what commonly happens when someone uses three wire cable to wire more than one fixture BETWEEN switches.

View attachment 3 light between 3 way wrong.bmp


*NOTE THIS DRAWING WRONG AND WILL NOT WORK PROPERLY. It is for information only.*


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## Parrothead (Mar 2, 2013)

Pretty sure Joe nailed it. I am thinking the electrician screwed it up. If you need to get a different electrician, then have him send the bill to the first one. He should never have left the house with them working like that.


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## Sparky723 (Mar 9, 2013)

JoeD said:
			
		

> Here what commonly happens when someone uses three wire cable to wire more than one fixture BETWEEN switches.
> 
> NOTE THIS DRAWING WRONG AND WILL NOT WORK PROPERLY. It is for information only.



Joe, 
They can be wired in series. Your diagram shows you taking your line neutral to the last light. 
Why not wire it like normal?


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## Blue Jay (Mar 9, 2013)

JoeD said:


> Here what commonly happens when someone uses three wire cable to wire more than one fixture BETWEEN switches.
> 
> View attachment 4850
> 
> ...



This picture shows the lights wired in series and is really going to confuse some people on here.


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## Fireguy5674 (Mar 9, 2013)

Sparky723 said:


> Joe,
> They can be wired in series. Your diagram shows you taking your line neutral to the last light.
> Why not wire it like normal?


 

I cannot quote code but my questions are:

1.  Code allows wiring lights in series?

2.  Why would you want to wire them in series?


The only advantage I see towiring that way would be the ability to run 1 three wire cable as apposed to 2 two wire cables.  I would never wire them in series if I was doing it.

Original poster, was not trying to hijack your post.  I believe Joe is correct in his diagnosis.


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## JoeD (Mar 9, 2013)

Did you not read the note in caps below the drawing. 

NOTE THIS DRAWING WRONG AND WILL NOT WORK PROPERLY. It is for information only.

Someone asked how this could be done wrong and I provided a diagram of the most common mistake made when wiring three ways switches with more than one light between them.
I have editted the font size and colour to make it more clear.


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## Fireguy5674 (Mar 10, 2013)

Sorry Joe I was actually quoting Sparky.  He seemed to be saying it was appropriate to wire them in series if you so choose.  Maybe I mistook his meaning.  I understand that you are not suggesting to wire in series and the diagram posted was how *NOT* to do it.


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## Sparky723 (Mar 10, 2013)

Ok.
Yes I'm an electrical contractor and yes, I know the difference between series and parallel ( to whoever asked).

Lights in general can be wired in series, however, can light housings nowadays usually come equipped with a termination block that automatically makes them wired in parallel.

I was stating in that diagram that the 12/3 wasn't ran correctly between switch boxes. That's all. 
I saw all text informing the reader it was incorrect.

A lot of times flicker on can lights, especially between 2 3ways is due to not having the correct switches. Lurton Maestro is a good series of switches that can be used.


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## bolsaboy (Mar 12, 2013)

Thanks for all the help guys. Had electrician come back and fix problem. Fireguy was correct in what he had done. Using one three wire and not two two wires.


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## Sparky723 (Mar 13, 2013)

bolsaboy said:
			
		

> Thanks for all the help guys. Had electrician come back and fix problem. Fireguy was correct in what he had done. Using one three wire and not two two wires.



Glad it's fixed but if wired right, a 12/3 (3 wire)  could've been used instead of 2 12/2's (2-2 wires) and been legal. The 2-2 wires just uses more wire.


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