# Can I not do a pocket joint with this Kreg?



## dborns (Mar 29, 2021)

I bought a Kreg Jig, (model 310 I believe), and the directions are lacking.  I can’t tell how to do a butt jig with this.  I’m building frames and using 1x4’s.  
The jig has a small grey adjuster that I can see how that works for other joints, but I can’t tell how, or if I can, adjust the jig for a flat(?) butt joint?
There’s got to be a way, but maybe this jig won’t work?


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## dborns (Mar 29, 2021)

Disregard.  It just didn’t look right, but it looks like it’s correct.  It just looked to far back.  I’ll try a crap piece.


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## havasu (Mar 29, 2021)

Kregs are cool. Too bad they need their own screws


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## Eddie_T (Mar 29, 2021)

Your layout looks like you're about to drill the wrong piece. You drill the end grain piece so the screw will go into straight grain. Trying the spacing on a piece of scrap is a good idea. I have the original which is designed for only 1x stock so no adjustment  other than depth. You can probably find instructions on Kreg site or youtube.


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## Eddie_T (Mar 29, 2021)

havasu said:


> Kregs are cool. Too bad they need their own screws


I have used other screws but washer head is best. Lowes carries Kreg and I think Hillman pocket screws.

Interesting, when I look at the picture above I noticed that I had not snugged the screws, they are now.


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## zannej (Mar 29, 2021)

Youtube tutorial


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## Spicoli43 (Mar 30, 2021)

Kreg's screws and bits are atrocious, like they planned them to disintegrate like they do. Makita makes MUCH better bits.


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## mabloodhound (Mar 30, 2021)

Eddie is correct.  Drill the piece "with" the grain so the screws will attach to the other piece "across" the grain.  I buy my screws from McFeely and yes, they must be flat bottom, otherwise a tapered screw might split the wood.


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## dborns (Mar 30, 2021)

Yep, I messed up and drilled them on the wrong piece.  I started noticing some of the screws wound bottom out, but weren’t tightening.  I then looked into it online, and read about not screwing into end grain as it’s not as strong?  I did use gorilla adhesive on each joint, but I’m going to try to back the screws out and I’ll clamp the jig on the correct piece by taking the depth guide off and see if I can drill new holes.
It’s important because these are going on heavy mirrors, and the hanging hardware will be on the horizontal pieces.  
Which brings me to my next question...


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## dborns (Mar 30, 2021)

How would you attach these frames to a mirror?  My initial thought was to use the same gorilla adhesive, and put a bunch on all the way around.  The top and bottom of the mirror are 

flush with the edges of the frame, but there’s about 1 1/2” of frame proud of the mirror on the sides to allow for the hanging hardware.
Using that gorilla glue would bond that frame pieces and mirror together making it one sturdy piece I would think.  And then I wouldn’t have to worry about redrilling new pocket holes, or is that a recommendation?


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## Eddie_T (Mar 30, 2021)

I wish the Kreg Jig had been available when I built my kitchen. I built face frames using glued cleats behind joints. I saw it demonstrated at the Atlanta Woodworking Show in the early 90s and ought mine soon after. My only complaint is that the original does only 1" stock or ½" stock by using a spacer. For occasional 2x4 joinery I can clamp on a piece of scrap with a predrilled pocket hole to serve as a guide.


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## Eddie_T (Mar 30, 2021)

I don't know, I haven't tried gluing glass to wood, expansion would be different.


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## dborns (Mar 30, 2021)

Good point I didn’t think about that.


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## Eddie_T (Mar 30, 2021)

You could use mirror clips to mount the mirror to the rear of the frame and hang the mirror as planned.
https://www.lowes.com/pd/Hillman-4-Count-Wide-Channel-Mirror-Clips/3384476
If you glue the mirror and frame don't get glue too close to inside edge of frame or it will reflect in the glass since mirrors are rear surfaced.


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## Flyover (Mar 30, 2021)

How heavy are these mirrors?

I used crown moulding to make a frame around a large bathroom mirror once, and found it was much too flimsy to support the weight of the mirror. I ended up connecting the top and bottom horizontal pieces together with one big piece of 1/4" plywood, which then took the weight of the mirror. I mounted the plywood on the wall by installing one of those sawtooth picture hangers on the back of it and hanging the whole thing on a nail or screw driven into a stud.

Edit: I think @Eddie_T 's mirror clips are probably the best way to go, so long as your frame is strong enough to support the mirror.


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## zannej (Mar 30, 2021)

I wish I could ask my dad how he adhered the mirrors on his desk to the wood framing. I believe he used a plywood backer and glued the mirror up then put frame around but I didn't watch him do it. Shame because the mirrors were my suggestion so his desk wouldn't feel so cramped and dark. He loved the effect.

There is a brand called Armor that used to lend other companies their patents. Kreg was allowed to make the clamps from their patent for many years but they are no longer allowed to use it. Supposedly their jigs are superior to Kreg's but are rather expensive. They have a 350piece screw set with jig for about $152. Screws are color coded by size.


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## Eddie_T (Mar 31, 2021)

I framed a large mirror (64"x 35") for a bath when I built the house. I made it with molding cutters on a radial arm saw. The mirror is inset like a picture in a frame. I think I used thin plywood  on the corners to hold the mirror in the inset.


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## zannej (Mar 31, 2021)

That looks nice, Eddie! I'm planning to frame out a mirror that has a beveled edge & turn it in to the door of a recessed (or partially recessed) medicine cabinet). I bought some trim & have plywood for a backer, but I'm trying to figure out the best way to put it together to hold the mirror in place and then add hinges. It will be heavy so I need sturdy hinges. I'm thinking maybe a continuous hinge plus two soft-close hinges so it will never slam and some sort of magnetic catch.

I sort of have my eye on the Armor pockethole jig. Just the jig is over $130 though & I'm wondering if it is worth it.


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## MrMiz (Mar 31, 2021)

dabs of clear silicone adhesive it the corners. They usually have the adhesive kind in the isle  with the glass and lexan.


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## dborns (Mar 31, 2021)

To those mentioning strength of the wood frame, wouldn’t gluing that glass all around basically make it really strong and one “unit”?


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## MrMiz (Mar 31, 2021)

dborns said:


> To those mentioning strength of the wood frame, wouldn’t gluing that glass all around basically make it really strong and one “unit”?


it would... wood moves especially in a bathrooms because of heat and moisture. So as long as your ok with the "seams" or corners opening up it would be fine. I have a couple mirrors where the frame is just stuck to the mirror directly with no other attachment. Basically sicks of wood glued to the mirror in a shape.


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## mabloodhound (Mar 31, 2021)

The mirror frame should have had rabbits cut into the back to set the mirror into.  Could still be done with a router and then the assembly would act as one unit.


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## Eddie_T (Apr 1, 2021)

@dborns Will the mirror be hung with long dimension vertical or horizontal?


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## zannej (Apr 2, 2021)

That's what I was thinking mabloodhound. On the one I'm making I was thinking of having rabbits for the frame on all of the trim pieces and a piece of plywood that it all attaches to the back, some of that rope putty for screens along the very edges for expansion/contraction of wood (not anywhere that would be visible) and silicone to hold corners to plywood.


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## Eddie_T (Apr 2, 2021)

From the OPs description I think the glass extends to the frame edge top and bottom. Here's an idea that could support the glass by merely extending the bottom board ¼ to the rear. I would use a thinner board and round the front edge for a better appearance or one could box the whole frame if desired.


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## Eddie_T (Apr 8, 2021)

I guess we lost the OP? That seems to happen often on these threads so we never know if the problem was solved. Whatever the solution is it may help others and does interest those of us who attempt to help.


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## zannej (Apr 8, 2021)

Yeah. I think going off topic might have done it, but maybe OP just lost interest.


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