# Fluidmaster value turns on/off, flush valve is new also.



## Back40 (Nov 10, 2011)

I recently (2 months) replaced both fill and flush valves in 2 toilets with Fluidmaster products. A week ago I noticed both toilets fill valves are turning on even though the water level in the tank is at the full mark. (Note: the water level at the full mark is below the overflow tube.) The fill valve runs for about 10 seconds before turning off. I did a test where I slghtly lifted the flapper allowing water to leak slowly into the bowl and found I had to allow the water level in the tank to drop at least 1.5" before the fill valve turned on. Therefore, this does not seem to be a problem with leaking around the flapper but a fill valve problem. Any ideas of additional adjustments I need to check/make? Thanks!


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## joecaption (Nov 10, 2011)

There's a plastic coller around the shaft where the unit mounts to the tank it needs to be adjusted.
http://www.fluidmaster.com/index.asp?bhcp=1


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## Back40 (Nov 11, 2011)

joecaption said:


> There's a plastic coller around the shaft where the unit mounts to the tank it needs to be adjusted.
> http://www.fluidmaster.com/index.asp?bhcp=1



Are you referring to adjusting the height of the fill value unit vertically? I have it mounted so that the ring is at least 1 inch above the overflow pipe per the instructions.


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## Redwood (Nov 11, 2011)

Did you dye test the toilet? Blue food coloring in the tank will probably reveal water from the tank going into the bowl.

Did you use the supplied clip for the bowl refill tube or, did you just shove it down the overflow tube?


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## Back40 (Nov 14, 2011)

Have not done the dye test yet but plan to. I did use the clip to attach the refill tube to the overflow pipe so no siphoning is taking place.


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## Back40 (Nov 15, 2011)

Dye (blue) test on both toilets resulted in light blue water in bowls, so I'll be replacing the flappers next. Question about flapper design/fit, should part of flapper that protrudes into the water outlet be the same approximate diameter as the outlet? Currently, the diameter of both flappers protrusions is about half the diameter of the water outlet. Thanks!


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## Redwood (Nov 15, 2011)

Try using either a Korky #2001BP or, for a 1.6 GPF toilet a Korky #16BP flapper. The Fuidmaster Flappers Stink!


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## karsar (Dec 6, 2011)

I have the same issue with a fluidmaster system. I went and got a fluidmaster flapper & replaced the old korky with it. Still the water keeps leaking into the bowl (I can visibly see the water getting down into the bowl).

After reading this thread i have bought a set which contains korky flapper & also a replacement flapper seat with the silicone sealant. i am going to replace the fluidmaster flapper with the korky one and see if that will do the job.

if it doesnt what are my next options?


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## Redwood (Dec 7, 2011)

Is the bowl refill tube placed down inside the overflow tube or is it attached to the top of the tube using the clip supplied with the Fuidmaster 400A?


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## karsar (Dec 8, 2011)

The refill tube is placed down inside the overflow tube. This is a universal-rundall system from 14 years ago.

i havent replaced the fluidmaster flapper with the korky one yet. Should i go ahead and try that (or) is there something else that we can try?

Should i try the dye test? I am positive it will turn out positive since i can clearly see the water leaking into the bowl. How can i identify the part that is actually leaking the water.


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## Redwood (Dec 9, 2011)

The bowl refill tube needs to clip on top of the overflow tube to prevent the water in the tank from siphoning through the refill tube into the bowl.

Universal-Rundall? There is a good reason why those aren't made anymore....
I'd say they have a spot in the top 10 list of worst designs for toilets...


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## karsar (Dec 11, 2011)

There is a small tube like opening at the top of the overflow tube and the refill tube is inserted into the overflow tube through that.

I dont see any clips on there. Is this something that i need to do manually? if so how do i do that? i can post a picture of how things look if that would help.


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## Puddlesx5 (Dec 11, 2011)

The Universal - Rundle needs to have a self supporting bowl fill . The only kind I know about are the Brass fill valve with copper tube that is stationary (not connected to the overflow tube). Big pain in the butt to fix and keep working correctly. Might I suggest a new Toilet.


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## Redwood (Dec 11, 2011)

Puddlesx5 said:


> The Universal - Rundle needs to have a self supporting bowl fill . The only kind I know about are the Brass fill valve with copper tube that is stationary (not connected to the overflow tube). Big pain in the butt to fix and keep working correctly. Might I suggest a new Toilet.



Yep either the tube has to be ridgid copper or, a very flexible line that can move with the flush valve.

I'd consider a new toilet as well....


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## karsar (Dec 15, 2011)

Thanks for the responses & suggestions.

I am a new Diy'er and would not risk changing the toilet myself. I have 3 toilets which are all universal-rundall. 2 of them developed this issue and i had addressed one of them by cleaning out the flapper with a scrotch-brite pad. After that it has stopped leaking water into the bowl.

If i had to change its better to change all 3 instead of just the one that is still having problems.

How much is the typical cost to get the toilets replaced? I saw a sign in home depot saying that they will do toilet installations (on specific ones i guess) for $69. I will need to update my guest bathroom as well since its outdated now. Putting a new toilet in there will look very odd - guess i can do that later on.


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## Redwood (Dec 15, 2011)

karsar said:


> How much is the typical cost to get the toilets replaced? I saw a sign in home depot saying that they will do toilet installations (on specific ones i guess) for $69.



You usually get what you pay for... 

I would highly recommend checking whatever toilet you decide on against the MaP Report listings for performance at this link... or if that link expires the new version will be found here...

The link above is the latest revision of the MaP Report in which toilets are tested for flushing capacity. However, it is not a test of quality only performance which is a good start. A toilet that constantly plugs up is certainly useless on that basis alone and we would be happy to discuss other aspects of various toilet models with you.

When you think about it having toilets that work well in your home is pretty important considering each person will use it about 5 times a day and it will remain in your home for 20 years or, more....

20 years of having a toilet that constantly plugs up, malfunctions causing high water usage and bills, or floods your home when the yellow zinc plated steel bolts securing the tank to the bowl rust away because the manufacturer was too cheap to use brass bolts, can easily erase any savings you had from buying a cheapo toilet....

When I pick out a toilet for my customers I install in most cases a Toto Drake II model CST454CEFG which can usually be obtained for around $300 despite the much higher MSRP listed on Toto's website. It is one of the few toilets sold in this country which stands a good chance of being manufactured in the USA.... Ironic considering Toto is a Japanese company.... Most US companies are making their toilets in China & Mexico....


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## karsar (Dec 15, 2011)

> You usually get what you pay for...



The installation charge is $69 & not the actual cost of the toilet itself. We just bought the house close to 2 yrs ago. We are newbies and didnt notice these things before buying the house.



> or floods your home when the yellow zinc plated steel bolts securing the tank to the bowl rust away because the manufacturer was too cheap to use brass bolts



I can see that the bolts are actually rusted in my toilets as well. Dont know how long i have until it gives away.

I will think about getting my toilets replaced soon. I will have more questions for the forum very soon ;-)


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## Redwood (Dec 16, 2011)

karsar said:


> The installation charge is $69 & not the actual cost of the toilet itself. We just bought the house close to 2 yrs ago. We are newbies and didnt notice these things before buying the house.



Right! And HD subs out it's work at low ball prices so you usually get a contractor that doesn't have a lot of irons in the fire so to speak, that is struggling to survive thinking they can make money on quantity not quality...


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